From A People Perspective

The Hidden Link Between Job Enjoyment and Performance with Jason Silver, Author & CEO of JI Business Advisory

The People People Group — Mon, 06 Apr 2026 16:24:41 -0400

In this episode, Jason Silver, a former Airbnb country manager turned author, shares eye-opening insights on rethinking productivity, leadership, and purpose. He reveals how scaling at breakneck speed taught him that focusing on culture and values especially the ones you pay a price for, can make or break your success. And he challenges the widely held myth that job satisfaction is about finding your passion it's about practicing it, day by day, task by task.

00:00 – Introduction & Jason Silver background
02:30 – From child actor to Airbnb: unconventional career path
06:10 – Inside Airbnb’s hypergrowth (400 → 2500 employees)
09:30 – “Don’t f*** up the culture”: lessons on scaling companies
12:30 – Why company values fail (and how to make them real)
17:00 – The book Your Grass is Greener explained
20:00 – Personal turning point: loss, perspective & mindset shift
23:30 – The “enjoyment → success” reversal (core philosophy)
28:30 – You have more control over your work than you think
42:30 – Practical exercise: redesign your work using enjoyment
47:15 – HR dilemma: misaligned roles & how to fix them
50:15 – Change HOW you work, not WHAT you do
53:00 – Small tweaks that compound into career satisfaction
59:30 – The future of work: danger of chasing “perfect jobs”
1:03:30 – Final insights on values, work, and fulfillment

How Alan is Redefining Benefits and Digital Health in Canada with Mark Goad, GM at Alan

The People People Group — Sun, 29 Mar 2026 21:54:25 -0400

In this insightful interview, Mark Goad, GM of Allen Canada, shares his journey through the tech and health sectors, discusses the future of healthcare and benefits in Canada, and explores the transformative role of AI in medicine and insurance.

00:00 Introduction and Guest Introduction
01:51 Music Preferences and Personal Interests
03:54 Early Career and First Job as Skate Instructor
05:02 Career Journey: From Strategy Consulting to Venture Capital
06:31 Experience in Silicon Valley and Tech Ecosystem
07:19 Canada's Tech Ecosystem vs Silicon Valley
09:09 Returning to Canada and Bringing Back Experience
10:54 Canadian Innovation and Ecosystem Strengths
12:02 Joining Alan and Healthcare Innovation
16:17 Motivation for Focusing on Healthcare
18:55 Impact of CAMH and Mental Health Initiatives
20:39 Trends in Employee Benefits and Healthcare Needs
27:17 Disconnect Between Employer Perceptions and Employee Needs
31:09 Evolving Employee Expectations in Benefits
33:55 Future of Benefits: Flexibility and Personalization
35:48 Long-term Vision for Healthcare and Benefits
38:14 Role of AI in Healthcare and Insurance
41:28 AI Adoption Timeline and Future Outlook
43:24 Personal Reflections on AI and Healthcare Innovation
47:06 Future of AI-Driven Health Insurance and Benefits
49:18 The Purple Marmot and Branding Strategy

Curiosity, Conviction & the Future of Work with Karam Tawfiq, Head Of Total Rewards & Ops at D2L

The People People Group — Mon, 23 Mar 2026 12:15:31 -0400

In this episode, HR leader Karam Tawfiq shares insights on the evolving landscape of human resources, the impact of AI on work, and the importance of authenticity and mentorship in career growth. Discover how to adapt, stay curious, and build genuine human connections in a rapidly changing world.

01:33 – Introduction and episode overview
02:01 – The production process and expectations for content sharing
02:37 – Reconnecting with Karam Tawfiq and his career journey
03:16 – Personal anecdotes and perseverance in podcasting
04:09 – Favorite music artists: Olivia Dean and Adele
05:09 – Midnight snack preferences: pasta vs. chicken nuggets
08:01 – Defining superpowers: caring as a fundamental trait
08:59 – Mentorship moments that shaped Karam’s career
10:19 – Hot takes on HR’s identity and purpose
14:48 – Karam’s career beginnings and unexpected career shifts
17:00 – Lessons from mentors and critical moments of growth
19:37 – The significance of mentorship and support in leadership
22:16 – Authenticity, curiosity, and staying true to oneself
24:06 – Experience vs. AI in building frameworks
26:15 – The future of work, AI’s influence, and societal impacts
29:37 – AI challenges and opportunities for HR and organizations
34:42 – Building genuine relationships and mentorship through support
38:17 – Curiosity about people and avoiding transactional interactions
42:43 – Understanding human motivation and egocentric behavior
45:21 – Societal systems that create transactional mindsets
46:55 – Concerns about AI reshaping roles and societal norms
50:28 – Continuous learning amid rapid technological change
54:06 – Strategies to stay grounded in the AI era
55:43 – Final reflections and appreciation

The Strategic Role of People Leaders at the Top with L. David Kingsley, CPO at Illumio

The People People Group — Mon, 02 Mar 2026 11:28:57 -0500

In this engaging conversation, L. David Kingsley, Chief People Officer at Illumio, shares insights from his diverse career journey, including his early days in management consulting, his transition to HR, and the lessons learned from military service. He emphasizes the importance of understanding organizational change, the significance of personal 'why', and how to navigate the evolving landscape of HR, especially with the advent of AI. Kingsley also discusses the need for optimism in challenging times and the role of leadership in fostering a supportive workplace culture.

Chapters
01:49 Introduction to L. David Kingsley
04:01 Career Beginnings and Transition to HR

06:15 Lessons from Management Consulting

16:15 Navigating Organisational Change & Growth Inflection Points

22:24 The Journey to Illumio
26:27 Military Lessons Applied to Business

32:57 The Importance of Personal ‘Why’

36:22 Staying Optimistic in Tough Times

40:52 Future Trends in HR and AI

Building Culture while Scaling Startups with Josh Domingues, Founder of MedWallet & FlashFood

The People People Group — Wed, 18 Feb 2026 11:14:41 -0500

In this episode, Josh Domingues shares the journey from hockey and finance to building Flashfood and launching MedWallet, offering an honest look at startup leadership, hiring, and building culture while scaling fast. The conversation explores how intuition, transparency, and human connection shape both product decisions and team dynamics, especially during moments of crisis and rapid growth. Josh also challenges traditional workplace practices like job descriptions and performance reviews while sharing his vision for the future of healthcare powered by AI.

00:00 - Introduction
04:22 - From Hockey Player to Finance to Consulting to Startups
09:50 - First Startup Failure
10:43 - Flashfood Idea: Solving Food Waste
11:45 - Scaling Flashfood & Raising $25M
17:23 - Founder Intuition & Being Early to Big Trends
20:23 - Building Culture & Motivating Frontline Workers
21:45 - COVID Crisis
24:05 - Leadership Lessons From Supporting Employees
28:00 - Why Companies Are Teams, Not Families
30:54 - Flashfood Culture, Systems & Rituals
32:55 - Why Performance Reviews Don’t Work
35:16 - How to Grow Fast in a Startup (Ignore Job Descriptions)
38:10 - Leadership Style: Strong Opinions Loosely Held
40:10 - Psychological Safety & Firing a Toxic Manager
43:52 - Spotting Bad Teammates (Sports → Business)
46:51 - MedWallet Origin Story
49:19 - Healthcare System Problems & Personal Experiences
49:50 - MedWallet Product Explained
52:20 - AI + Healthcare Future
53:30 - Final Advice: Authenticity in the AI Era

A Winding Path to People Leadership with Lorena Scott, CPO at Relay

The People People Group — Sun, 08 Feb 2026 22:02:51 -0500

In this podcast episode, Martin Hauck interviews Lorena Scott, a seasoned Chief People Officer, about her unconventional career journey, the influence of her father's resilience, and her insights on leadership and people operations. Lorena shares her experiences from investment banking to private equity, and ultimately to her current role at Relay, where she emphasizes the importance of culture, curiosity, and the impact of AI in the workplace. The conversation highlights the challenges and joys of scaling teams, navigating mergers and acquisitions, and the significance of serving small businesses.

01:23 Introduction
02:54 Lorena’s Unconventional Path to People Leadership
04:49 Inspiration from Family and Early Aspirations
06:25 Resilience and Reinvention: A Father’s Influence
09:04 First Jobs and Early Career Experiences
10:38 Investment Banking as a Learning Bootcamp
13:28 Transition to Private Equity and Understanding Culture
20:08 The Shift into People Operations
23:38 Curiosity as a Key Leadership Trait
26:10 Testing for Curiosity in Hiring
28:27 Reflections on Executive Roles in People Ops
29:57 Scaling, Global Growth, and Career Transitions
31:53 Navigating Mergers and Acquisitions
38:10 Finding Fulfillment in Work
42:17 Scaling Culture While Growing Fast
47:06 Embracing AI in People Operations
52:03 Lessons Learned in People Leadership
57:04 Final Career Advice and Closing Thoughts

The Art of Asking Better Questions with Topaz Adizes, Founder of The Skin Deep

The People People Group — Sun, 01 Feb 2026 20:45:57 -0500

Summary

In this engaging conversation, Topaz Adidas, an Emmy award-winning experience design architect, shares his journey of exploring human connection in the digital age. He discusses the evolution of emotional experiences due to technology, the importance of authentic conversations, and how to create safe spaces for vulnerability. Topaz emphasizes the significance of asking the right questions and the impact of AI on human interaction. He reflects on balancing artistry with business and the future of The Skin Deep, a platform dedicated to fostering meaningful connections.

Chapters
01:23 Introduction to Topaz Adidas and His Work
04:24 The Evolution of Human Connection in the Digital Age
07:24 The Role of Music and Personal Experiences
10:14 Navigating Early Career Challenges and Self-Discovery
13:00 The Importance of Authentic Conversations
15:58 Capturing Human Emotion Through Film
18:54 The Patterns of Human Interaction
21:38 Creating Safe Spaces for Vulnerable Conversations
24:32 The Power of Intentions in Conversations
27:24 Building Trust in Professional Settings
30:12 The Impact of AI on Human Interaction
33:07 The Importance of Asking the Right Questions
36:19 Balancing Artistry and Business
39:00 The Future of The Skin Deep and Community Engagement
42:01 Final Thoughts and How to Connect with Topaz

The Talent Advantage: What Most Recruiters Get Wrong with Michael Solomon, Co-Founder of 10x Management

The People People Group — Thu, 15 Jan 2026 21:09:57 -0500

In this episode of From a People Perspective, Martin Hauck sits down with Michael Solomon, Founder and Talent Agent at 10x Management, for a candid conversation about what’s actually happening inside modern hiring.
Michael brings a talent-first lens to recruitment, challenging common assumptions about the role of recruiters, the responsibility of hiring managers, and why HR often gets blamed for problems it doesn’t control. Together, they unpack why reliability and judgment matter more than raw skill, how AI is changing hiring workflows without replacing human decision-making, and where expectations between candidates, recruiters, and companies are breaking down.

01:50 Icebreakers and first jobs
03:39 From nursing homes to Bruce Springsteen
07:47 Lessons from managing world-class musical talent
10:26 From music management to tech talent
14:12 Why talent should be the client
22:16 What actually matters when assessing talent
29:34 Contractors, expectations, and clarity
35:14 Living with AI uncertainty
40:18 How AI improves internal recruiting workflows
43:46 Boardy and the future of HR connections
54:30 Who Michael works with and closing thoughts

People, Process & Prompts: The New Rules of Work In HR & Talent with Joel Lalgee, GTM Recruiter & Content Creator

The People People Group — Sun, 04 Jan 2026 21:40:47 -0500

In this conversation, Joel Lalgee, known as the 'Realest Recruiter', shares his journey into recruitment, the impact of social media on the industry, and the importance of human connection in a tech-driven world. He discusses the challenges faced by recruiters and candidates in the current job market, the role of AI in recruitment, and the need for emotional intelligence and relationship-building skills. Joel emphasizes that while technology is evolving, the human element remains crucial in recruitment.

01:36 Introduction to the Realest Recruiter
04:29 The Journey into Recruitment
07:30 First Jobs and Career Beginnings
10:23 Transitioning into Recruitment
13:34 The Evolution of Content Creation
16:18 Impact of Video and Community Engagement
19:28 Building a Personal Brand
22:22 The Power of Authenticity in Recruitment
26:41 Building Community vs. Growing an Audience
30:16 Understanding Recruitment Challenges
32:08 The Role of Recruiters in Job Placement
33:32 Navigating the Current Job Market
36:20 AI's Impact on Recruitment
40:42 The Importance of Human Connection
46:25 Future Trends in Recruitment

Why Focusing on Business Strategy Empowers The People Function with Rebecca Price, Partner and CPO at Primary Venture Partners

The People People Group — Sun, 30 Nov 2025 22:09:20 -0500

In this episode, Martin Hauck interviews Rebecca Price from Primary Ventures, exploring her unique career journey from sports psychology to organizational psychology and her transition into the startup ecosystem. They discuss the importance of mentorship, the challenges of remote work, and the rapid pace of technological change in the workplace. Rebecca emphasizes the need for young professionals to build their networks and be proactive in seeking opportunities, while also highlighting the importance of understanding business needs as a people leader.

01:36 Introduction and Icebreakers
04:34 Rebecca's Career Journey
07:41 Transitioning to Tech and Startups
10:34 The Role of Mentorship
13:26 Entering the Venture Capital World
16:25 Building a People-Centric VC Firm
19:38 Innovative Recruitment Strategies in VC
27:12 Scaling Talent Acquisition for Startups
31:07 The Impact of Remote Work on Early Career Development
34:49 Networking and Building Relationships in a Remote World
37:27 Balancing Ambition and Work-Life Expectations
44:51 Navigating Rapid Technological Change in Business
50:14 Aligning HR Strategies with Business Goals

Why Curiosity Beats Control In Modern Leadership with Melissa Marcelissen, COPO at Certn

The People People Group — Sun, 09 Nov 2025 22:40:52 -0500

In this episode of 'From A People Perspective', Martin Hauck interviews Melissa Marcelissen, Chief Operating People Officer at Certn. They discuss the importance of curiosity in HR, navigating professional traps, and the evolution of HR roles in the context of operations and people management. Melissa shares her journey to leadership, the significance of inclusive leadership, and the challenges of balancing operational responsibilities with people management. They also explore the impact of AI on the future of work and the necessity of letting go of control as a leader to empower teams. The conversation concludes with Melissa's advice on leaning into one's passions and defining one's career path.

01:47 Introduction and Icebreakers
04:50 The Importance of Curiosity in HR
07:47 Navigating Professional Traps
10:34 Finding Passion in Your Work
13:41 Melissa's Journey to HR Leadership
16:53 The Impact of Inclusive Leadership
19:55 Evolving Roles in Operations and People Management
27:26 Navigating Daily Operations and Team Dynamics
28:45 Transitioning from Consulting to Full-Time Roles
31:26 Defining Executive Roles and Expectations
34:30 Innovative Approaches to Executive Hiring
37:07 The Importance of Clear Communication in Leadership
39:54 Bridging the Gap Between Operations and People
43:36 Empowering Teams Through Connection and Collaboration
45:58 Fostering Internal Mobility and Curiosity
48:25 Preparing for the Future: AI and Productivity
52:27 Letting Go: The Shift from Doer to Leader

The Quiet Achiever's Rebellion: Rewriting Success with Linda Raynier CPA, CA, Author

The People People Group — Mon, 20 Oct 2025 05:14:00 -0400

In this engaging conversation, Martin Hauck interviews Linda Raynier, a career strategist and author, who shares her transformative journey from accounting to career coaching. Linda discusses the challenges she faced, including her husband's health crisis, and how these experiences shaped her mission to empower 'quiet achievers'—introverted individuals who often feel overlooked in the corporate world. She emphasizes the importance of intuition, emotional release, and self-reflection in navigating career changes, especially in today's evolving job market. Linda's upcoming book, 'The Quiet Achiever', aims to provide guidance and support for those seeking to express their authentic confidence and find fulfillment in their careers.

Chapters
00:00 - Introduction
01:25 - Icebreakers
05:46 - Linda's Journey: From Accounting to Career Coaching
09:14 - Overcoming Challenges and Finding Purpose
12:27 - The Impact of Personal Life on Professional Identity
15:22 - The Dream and the Book: A Journey of Intuition
18:07 - Supporting Quiet Achievers in the Workplace
20:17 - Visualization and Intuition in Career Development
22:33 - Exploring the Power of Intuition
25:47 - Tactical Insights for Career Growth
30:38 - Telepathic Communication and Intuition
32:44 - Visualization and Parallel Universes
34:42 - Listening to Your Instincts
35:46 - The Importance of Inner Work
39:24 - Navigating Career Transitions
41:45 - The Quiet Achiever's Journey
42:40 - The FLU Method for Emotional Healing
45:03 - Embracing Authenticity in Career
55:03 - Opportunities in Times of Change
57:49 - Outro

The Hiring Philosophy That Built a Billion-Dollar Remote Company with Brandon Sammut, CPO at Zapier

The People People Group — Sun, 21 Sep 2025 23:01:51 -0400

In this conversation, Martin Hauck interviews Brandon Sammut, the Chief People Officer at Zapier. They discuss Brandon's journey from education to tech, the challenges he faced in building a strong people team at Zapier, and the importance of workplace culture. Brandon shares insights on how automation and AI are transforming organizations and emphasizes that these changes are as much about people and culture as they are about technology.

Chapters
00:00 - Introduction to Brandon Simon and Zapier
03:45 - Icebreakers and Personal Insights
06:33 - The Impact of Education on Career Choices
09:28 - Motivations Behind People and Talent Work
12:32 - Career Journey: From Education to Tech
15:35 - Transitioning from Nonprofit to Tech
18:20 - Finding Purpose in Software Companies
21:16 - The Culture at LiveRamp and Zapier
25:00 - Building Lifelong Relationships in Recruitment
26:23 - The Journey to Zapier: A Unique Opportunity
29:10 - Navigating Loyalty and Career Transitions
35:06 - The State of Zapier: A New Era in People Operations
45:17 - The Future of Automation and AI in Organizations
51:15 - Outro

The Unfiltered Truth About Recruiting with Shally Steckerl, Associate Principal Consultant at Riviera Advisors

The People People Group — Thu, 04 Sep 2025 11:19:55 -0400

In this engaging conversation, Martin and Shelly delve into the intricacies of sourcing and recruiting, exploring the importance of human connection, the impact of technology, and the lessons learned throughout their careers. Shelly shares her insights on the evolving landscape of talent acquisition, the significance of understanding candidates' needs, and the future of recruiting in an AI-driven world. With anecdotes and success stories, they highlight the value of building trust and the art of connecting with candidates in meaningful ways.

00:00 Introduction and Background
05:21 The Evolution of Sourcing and Recruiting
10:39 Lessons from the Next Generation
14:33 Universal Truths in Recruiting
20:33 The Role of Technology in Recruitment
26:24 Tools of the Trade
32:14 Deep Search for Talent
33:00 Mindset Shift in Recruiting
35:15 The Grind of Inbox Recruiting
37:55 Value Beyond Hires
40:24 Memorable Success Stories
48:30 Building Trust with Clients
54:45 Future of AI in Recruiting
01:03:22 Actual Podcast Outro.mp4

Navigating the Future of Recruitment with Jim Miller, VP of People & Talent at Ashby

The People People Group — Sun, 27 Jul 2025 22:14:31 -0400

In this episode, Jim Miller, VP of People and Talent at Ashby, shares his extensive experience in recruitment, discussing the evolution of recruitment technology, the importance of quality of hire, and the impact of AI on the industry. He emphasizes continuous improvement and the balance between quality and volume in hiring, while also providing insights into Ashby's innovative approach to talent acquisition. Jim offers valuable advice for professionals looking to future-proof their careers in a rapidly changing landscape.

Chapters
00:00 Introduction and Background
04:06 The Evolution of Recruitment Technology
06:58 Jim's Journey in Recruitment
09:43 Transitioning from Google to Ashby
12:32 Continuous Improvement in Recruitment
15:47 Quality vs. Volume in Hiring
18:32 The Importance of Quality of Hire
21:52 Data-Driven Recruitment Strategies
24:50 Future Trends in Talent Acquisition
27:43 AI and Its Impact on Recruitment
30:26 Ashby's Innovations and Future Plans
33:28 Final Thoughts and Advice

The Future of Hiring: Skills-Based Assessments with Olive Turon of TestGorilla

The People People Group — Tue, 17 Jun 2025 16:12:20 -0400

In this conversation, Olive Turon, Head of People and Culture at TestGorilla, shares her journey through various roles leading to her current position. She discusses the importance of skills-based hiring and how TestGorilla aims to democratize opportunities in the hiring process. Olive highlights the challenges of traditional hiring practices, the consequences of poor hiring decisions, and the need for a shift towards more effective recruitment strategies. The discussion emphasizes the significance of matching candidates with the right roles and the impact of using assessment tools to enhance the hiring process.

For anyone interested in the Skills Based Hiring report mentioned in this podcast, you can access it here.

Navigating Employment Law with Lisa Stam of Spring Law

The People People Group — Mon, 21 Apr 2025 18:09:20 -0400

In this episode of 'From a People Perspective', Martin Hauck speaks with Lisa Stam, founder of Spring Law, about the evolution of virtual law firms, the importance of communication in HR, and the impact of technology and AI on employment law. They discuss the challenges HR professionals face in navigating employee and employer relationships, the significance of understanding generational differences in the workplace, and best practices for effective HR management. Lisa emphasizes the need for collaboration between HR and legal professionals and the importance of staying updated with legal changes.

An Uncanny Chat with Sesame's AI

The People People Group — Sun, 06 Apr 2025 22:22:11 -0400

In this unusual podcast episode, Martin and an AI named Maya explore the intersection of artificial intelligence and human resources. They discuss the innovative technology behind Sesame, the potential of AI in recruitment, and the importance of addressing unconscious bias. The conversation also delves into the ethical responsibilities of AI developers and concludes with a reflection on the human element in hiring processes.

The Truth About Fake Job Postings with Hilary Wagner, Chief Talent Officer

The People People Group — Fri, 28 Feb 2025 07:23:48 -0500

In this episode of 'From a People Perspective', host Martin Hauck engages with Hilary Wagner, Chief People and Talent Officer at Tribe Wellness, discussing various aspects of recruitment, the impact of AI, and the importance of transparency in hiring practices. They explore the challenges faced by recruiters, the myths surrounding AI in recruitment, and the significance of continuous learning in the ever-evolving landscape of HR. Hilary shares her experiences in writing, publishing, and her involvement in health technology, emphasizing the need for recruiters to adapt and innovate in their approaches.

The Power of Swag in Employee Engagement with Michael Martocci, Founder of SwagUp

The People People Group — Wed, 12 Feb 2025 14:00:00 -0500

In this episode of 'From a People Perspective', Martin Hauck interviews Michael Martocci, CEO of Swag Up, discussing the importance of branding in the swag industry, the impact of swag on employee experience, and innovative uses of swag in recruitment. Michael shares lessons learned from previous ventures, the significance of company culture, and how AI is shaping the future of business operations. The conversation emphasizes the need for companies to be deliberate in crafting employee experiences and the value of maintaining a strong team dynamic.

Navigating Job Hunts & Building Resilient Networks with Amy McLellan

The People People Group — Sun, 01 Dec 2024 20:47:59 -0500

In this episode Martin Hauck and Amy McLellan discuss the challenges of job seeking in the current market, particularly in light of recent layoffs. They explore the importance of community support, effective job search strategies, and the mindset shifts necessary during career transitions. The conversation emphasizes the value of networking, building supportive communities for job seekers, and the unique journeys individuals face in their job searches. They also touch on the metrics for engagement in community building and the potential for creating virtual spaces for job seekers to connect and support one another.

Balloons To Boardrooms

The People People Group — Sun, 17 Nov 2024 18:58:05 -0500

In this episode of 'From a People Perspective', Martin Hauck and Michaud Garneau explore the themes of personal growth, performance, and the art of clowning. They discuss the journey from aspiring circus performers to realizing the importance of hard work and vulnerability in skill development. The conversation delves into the balance of praise and effort, the role of the clown in reflecting audience emotions, and the significance of community support in professional growth. In this conversation, Michaud Garneau discusses the intersection of performance art, particularly clowning, and corporate culture. He emphasizes the importance of vulnerability, authenticity, and the challenges of bringing one's full self to work. The dialogue explores the nuances of professionalism, the need for safe spaces in the workplace, and the significance of effective communication, particularly through public speaking. Michaud shares insights on how to frame messages for leadership and the importance of understanding the audience's perspective. The conversation concludes with a focus on the tangible results of effective communication and the ongoing journey of personal development.

Squiggly Line Careers & Mindsets with Nancy Konopinsky, On-Demand COO at Naked Consulting

The People People Group — Sun, 03 Nov 2024 13:04:47 -0500

In this episode of 'From a People Perspective', host Martin Hauck speaks with Nancy Konopinsky, an on-demand COO and founder of Naked Consulting. They discuss Nancy's journey from studying psychology to a successful career in marketing and operations, her transition to consulting, and her focus on empowering women entrepreneurs. The conversation also touches on the importance of mindset, leadership challenges, and the role of AI in business.

The Path To CPO and AI for Execs with Sejal Patel Daswani, CPO of Deputy

The People People Group — Wed, 23 Oct 2024 19:23:53 -0400

In this episode of 'From a People Perspective', host Martin Hauck engages with Sejal Patel Daswani, a seasoned HR leader, discussing her unique career journey, the importance of management consulting in HR, and the evolving landscape of HR technology. They explore the challenges of scaling companies, the role of mentorship, and the impact of AI on HR practices. Sejal shares insights on building a strong culture in large organizations and the mission of Deputy in supporting frontline workers. The conversation emphasizes the need for connection, belonging, and continuous learning in the workplace.

The Clubhouse Model: A Path to Belonging

The People People Group — Thu, 10 Oct 2024 13:09:42 -0400

In this episode of From a People Perspective, host Marty engages with Ali and Brandon from Progress Place, a community center dedicated to supporting individuals with mental illness. They discuss the Clubhouse model, which emphasizes community, belonging, and co-designing programs with members. The conversation highlights the importance of transitional employment programs in providing opportunities for individuals to reintegrate into the workforce while addressing stigma and promoting mental health awareness in the workplace. The episode also touches on personal insights, challenges faced during the pandemic, and the significance of open communication in fostering a supportive environment.

Building Cultures of Emotional Intelligence with Angela Payne & Charles Fortier of LeedHR

The People People Group — Mon, 30 Sep 2024 12:03:26 -0400

In this conversation, Angela Payne and Charles Fortier discuss their journey in founding LeedHR, focusing on the importance of emotional intelligence in leadership. They share personal stories, insights on navigating emotional intelligence assessments, and the transformative experiences they've had with clients. The discussion also touches on the cultural readiness for emotional intelligence work, the role of AI in leadership, and the significance of curiosity and flexibility in personal and professional development.

The Future of AI in Recruitment with Co-founder of PeopleGPT, David Paffenholz

The People People Group — Sun, 15 Sep 2024 23:59:09 -0400

In this conversation, David Paffenholz, founder of PeopleGPT, shares insights into his journey from education to entrepreneurship, the impact of social media on business growth, and the challenges and opportunities in the recruiting landscape. He discusses the features and functionality of PeopleGPT, the importance of addressing bias in AI, and the evolving role of recruiters in the age of technology. David also highlights the company's growth, market position, and future developments, emphasizing the significance of building a strong company culture in a virtual environment.

BTW for the keen listeners, here's a link to the David's go to album by Peter Fox.

The Role of Generalists in the Future of Work with Kai Algar

The People People Group — Mon, 09 Sep 2024 06:00:00 -0400

Kai Algar shares her career journey, which has been characterized by adaptability and a diverse range of experiences. She started in business and accounting, then pursued interior design and real estate. She later explored UX and found her passion in applying it to employee experience. Kai has worked in startups, consulting, and recruitment, constantly learning and adapting to new challenges. She emphasizes the need for businesses to future-proof themselves and build equitable models in the changing world of work. In this part of the conversation, Kai and Martin discuss the need for a shift in the way education is done and the importance of self-education and self-reflection. They also explore the limitations of the current system and the need for a more flexible and adaptable approach to work. Kai emphasizes the importance of building small and medium-sized businesses that focus on sustainability and quality rather than infinite growth. They also discuss the need to dissolve hierarchies and empower employees through an employee-owned model. Finally, they touch on the challenges of scaling and pivoting in larger companies and propose a squad model as a solution. The conversation explores the need to hire for the right qualities and create decentralized work environments. It emphasizes the importance of employee ownership and equitable compensation. The discussion also touches on the challenges faced by founders and the potential of generalists in the future of work. The guest shares their vision of building tools and structures to enable a more sustainable and engaging work culture.

Learning about aphantasia with Dr. Adam Zeman

The People People Group — Mon, 26 Aug 2024 00:30:35 -0400

In this episode, Martin interviews Dr. Adam Zeman, a researcher who has studied aphantasia for the past 10 years. They discuss the concept of aphantasia, which is the inability to visualize mental images, and its implications for individuals' experiences and creativity. Dr. Zeman shares that aphantasia is not a disability but rather a variation in human experience. They also explore the challenges of understanding and describing different subjective experiences, as well as the potential subtypes and genetic factors associated with aphantasia. Dr. Zeman provides resources for further exploration of the topic.

From Nike to Duck Duck Go to Oyster to remote work Author and Expert, meet Ali Greene, author of Remote Works

The People People Group — Mon, 22 Jul 2024 01:31:48 -0400

Lessons from an office liquidator, Marlon McPherson, Owner of Michaels Global Trading

The People People Group — Sun, 07 Jul 2024 16:35:31 -0400

Marlon shares his entrepreneurial journey and the origin of Michael's Global Trading. He provides insights into the process of managing office furniture and equipment when a business moves or shuts down. Marlon also discusses his biggest project to date, clearing out 13 floors of furniture for a major construction company, and the impact it had on his business. He shares his plans for the future, including exploring import-export opportunities, and offers advice for aspiring entrepreneurs.

Failing and Failing Forward with Ashley Good, Founder and CEO of Fail Forward

The People People Group — Mon, 10 Jun 2024 02:29:49 -0400

Ashley Good, CEO and founder of Fail Forward, discusses the importance of embracing failure and creating a healthy relationship with it. She shares her personal journey and the inspiration behind starting Fail Forward.

Takeaways

Failure is a natural part of life and should be embraced as a learning opportunity.
Creating a healthy relationship with failure involves destigmatizing it and having open conversations about it.
Organizations need to shift their mindset and embrace risk and innovation in order to adapt to a rapidly changing world.
Embrace failure as a learning opportunity and create a culture that allows for open discussions about what didn't work.
Focus on the small things that you have control over and gradually build the skill of killing low-value work.
Challenge the bias towards constantly being busy and prioritize the right things over doing things right.
Develop a healthy relationship with failure by practicing self-compassion and giving yourself grace.

Chapters
(00:00) Introduction and Door Number C

(03:00) Aliens and Favorite Albums

(06:01) The Importance of Failure

(10:11) Grocery Bag Indulgences

(13:32) Ashley's Journey and the Birth of Fail Forward

(23:30) Selling Failure as a Business

(27:26) Why Failure is Hard for Us

(31:20) The Importance of Learning from Failure

(35:09) The Momentum Around Failure

(36:37) Saying No to Low-Value Work

(37:39) Embracing Failure as a Learning Opportunity

(41:45) Killing Projects and the Value of Retrospectives

(50:57) Challenges of Work-Life Balance and the Pressure to be Busy

(01:13:31) The Importance of Self-Compassion in the Face of Failure

Recruiting Marketers with Sarah Brekelmans, Founder and Principal Recruiter @ Brightly

The People People Group — Sun, 05 May 2024 18:43:37 -0400

Sarah Brekelmans shares her journey from working in the car rental industry to founding her own recruitment agency, Brightly. She discusses the frustrations with technology in remote recording, her passion for marketing, and the importance of taking risks on high potential hires. The conversation explores the challenges and misalignment in evaluating and hiring marketers. It emphasizes the importance of finding the right marketing leader and understanding their strengths and areas that need support.

Chapters
(12:55) Background and Early Career
(19:23) Favorite Pizza and Album
(24:16) Transition to Recruitment
(29:00) Realization and Shift to Sales
(34:33) Taking Risks on High Potential Hires
(37:48) Niche Recruitment in Marketing
(40:24) Misalignment in Evaluating Marketers
(44:17) Finding the Right Marketing Leader
(46:51) Hiring Challenges for Founders and CEOs
(49:18) Identifying Strengths and Outsourcing
(53:14) Evaluating Marketing Leaders
(56:06) Changing Landscape of Hiring
(59:24) Pressure Testing the Hiring Manager
(01:02:30) Brightly's Focus and Expertise

The coolest, most impressive and yet scariest guest on our podcast so far...

The People People Group — Mon, 20 Nov 2023 10:16:56 -0500

I sit across from the latest marvel in AI, the voice chat version GPT-4, developed by OpenAI. We talk about how AI can assist HR and Recruitment professionals, the risks associated and I go full blown hard hitting journalist and ask it some questions about the drama at OpenAI this weekend.

This podcast and The People People Group is made possible by our sponsors, if you're not a member, check out Canada's most engaged HR/Recruitment/Operations community by heading over to www.thepeoplepeoplegroup.com.

The Leadership Agency is one of North America and the UK's best boutique startup recruitment agencies
Level up your employee recognition with Chocolate Soup's awesome custom mini-figurines and more
Singer Steinberg Group Benefits Specialists, if they can't help you they'll intro you to someone awesome who will
SpringLaw is Canada's first (and best) virtual employment law firm
Wavy is a culture management platform for flexible teams

Hire Vincent Loris - Senior Product Designer / Ex-Founder

The People People Group — Fri, 20 Oct 2023 11:07:05 -0400

This episode format doesn't have a name yet, but they're short, sweet and mini interviews with interesting people who are looking for their next thing.

Meet Vincent Loris! He's looking for interesting Senior Product Designer positions. He's an ex-Founder of a music / e-comm marketplace.

This podcast and The People People Group is made possible by our sponsors, if you're not a member, check out Canada's most engaged HR/Recruitment/Operations community by heading over to www.thepeoplepeoplegroup.com.

- The Leadership Agency is one of North America and the UK's best boutique startup recruitment agencies
- SpringLaw is Canada's first (and best) virtual employment law firm
- Wavy is a culture management platform for flexible teams

Coffee, Kale and Leadership with Melissa and Johnathan Nightingale - Founders of Raw Signal Group

The People People Group — Tue, 05 Sep 2023 11:29:50 -0400

Melissa Nightingale and Johnathan Nightingale are the founders of Raw Signal Group, literal and figurative owners of http://worldsbestnewsletter.com/ and beyond knowing too much about coffee and kale, they also know too much about building the leadership culture and connections most founders are striving towards. We talk about why it's so elusive, and a bunch of other really random yet insightful stuff. You're here to listen not read so dive on in.

Key Moments:

(1:00) – Icebreakers!

(12:06) – Describing themselves to the uninitiated

(13:16) – You don’t leave exec roles just for money

(15:00) – Building better bosses!

(19:55) – Stories that remind why

(29:20) – Sticker Culture, ‘R.A.C.I’ acronym

(32:00) – Martin’s time as a…Free Mason?!?!

(34:45) – Building culture not a cult

(41:20) – The most frustrating part

(48:30) – Coherence is important

(1:01:00) – ‘Thank you note Applicants,’ having preferences in your hiring process

(1:16:00) – Managers don’t want to hate their work/life

(1:20:30) – Asking “what happens if we don’t do X?"

(1:26:20) – Everyone wants a cheat code...

(1:34:08) – Closing Remarks

- The Leadership Agency is one of North America and the UK's best boutique startup recruitment agencies
- SpringLaw is Canada's first (and best) virtual employment law firm
- Wavy is a culture management platform for flexible teams

Breaking Barriers For Others As A Recruiter with Shannon Ogborn - Community Lead & Recruiting Operations Consultant at Ashby

The People People Group — Mon, 17 Jul 2023 05:43:23 -0400

Shannon Ogborn shares her career journey with us, from being an assistant to jumping into tech and making her way into the world of recruitment operations at Hired, moving onto and away from Google and now leading community and RecOps at Ashby. Shannon shares a ton of amazing takes on the space and shares some key points on ensuring your recruitment practices are inclusive by design.

(1:00) – Introduction

(2:22) – Should we really call it an ATS!?

(4:50) – Icebreakers

(12:00) – Takeaways from learning photography as a hobby

(14:00) – History of Shannon’s journey in HR/Recruitment

(21:18) – Meaningful people along Shannon’s journey

(25:50) – Shannon’s POV on anonymizing profiles of candidates

(31:00) – Best part of being a recruiter; changing status quo around hiring practices

(35:00) – Shannon’s experience and tips for folks looking to work at larger companies

(42:00) – Diversity hiring, how to be intentional in hiring

(53:21) – Who Shannon modelled her practices after, influences, etc

(59:41) – What’s most exciting about working for Ashby

(65:46) – What Shannon is most excited about with the market and Ashby’s role in addressing problems

(74:10) – Closing remarks

From Analytics To Author And Founder, Finding Your Self To Find Your Path with Alysha M. Campbell - CEO of CultureShift HR

The People People Group — Thu, 27 Apr 2023 07:33:38 -0400

Alysha M. Campbell didn't start out in People Ops, she went from multiple roles in business analytics to recruitment, to HR. Carving a path for herself and landing at notable companies like The Economist as their Senior Global HR Business Partner before starting CultureShift HR a company borne of an unrelenting need that now fills her cup.

She is a 4x award-winning, best-selling author and a highly respected Strategic Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion Leader with a decade of experience encompassing all facets of Human Resource Management and DEI. From executing successful multi-million dollar workforce diversity and optimization projects to spearheading inclusive employee culture initiatives, Alysha has truly seen and done it all in the DEI space.

Alysha and I dive into the behind the scenes of the self, the journey of self discovery and what sparked her starting her own firm.

Shownotes
(00:56) – Introduction

(03:05) – Icebreakers

(07:40) – Magic behind Alysha’s social media

(09:40) – the story of Alysha career history; birthing CultureShift HR
(21:20) – how Alysha worked towards carving her own path

(26:00) – What are the most impactful resources Alysha has used?

(32:44) – What did and didn’t work for Alysha during the discovery period

(37:04)– Understanding what freedom looks like from yourself before sharing with others

(40:00) – People who supported Alysha along the way

(47:14) – Intentions around who Alysha wants to work with
(52:40) – Reactions to divestment from DEI initiatives

(1:00:45) – Importance of investing in people/equity in the workplace

(1:06:15) – Finding balance amidst the intensity of working in DEI

(1:13:00) – What’s on Alysha’s vision board

(1:17:00) – How to stay in touch with Alysha!

(1:18:40) – Closing remarks

Applying Design Principles To Your Candidate & Employee Experiences with Elsawy Yehia - Product & Design Leader

The People People Group — Fri, 17 Feb 2023 07:09:29 -0500

Elsawy Yehia is a curious soul and seasoned product and design leader in tech. With career adventures spanning over 20 years, 6 countries, 7 industries, 13 brands, and over a dozen public speaking engagements. He is most fulfilled when helping people grow to become better thinkers and makers.

We covers how Elsawy came into the world of product, design, leadership and how to apply design principles to your candidate and employee experiences.

From A People Perspective and The People People Group is made possible by our sponsors, if you're not a member, check out Canada's most engaged HR/Recruitment/Operations community.

The Leadership Agency is one of North America and the UK's best boutique startup recruitment agencies
Wavy is the culture management platform for flexible teams
Wealthsimple For Work has group RRSPs for your employees that looks and feels like a modern day RRSP program
SpringLaw is Canada's first (and best) virtual employment law firm

Shownotes:

00:00 – Introduction

(3:20) – How many companies are doing a good job of designing the employee/candidate experience?

(5:30) – Icebreaker question

(9:10) – Reflection on past work, leading to where he is today

(13:25) – Refining your character, learning more about yourself

(14:50) – How Elsawy got to where he is today

(20:35) – “You have to have been a player to become a coach”

(24:40) - “Building people who love building great products”

(33:20)– Elsawy’s Manifesto

(37:25) – Origin of why Manifesto was created, how can People Ops folks apply this practise for themselves?

(45:10) – Coming to interviews with a framework on leadership

(47:00) – The importance of trust building with products

(57:40) – ‘Pre-totyping’

(1:07:05) – Elsawy’s upcomingbBook; Product People: A Journal of Laughter and Tears

(1:10:20) – Closing remarks

The Journey Of A Lifelong Builder with Regina Gerbeaux - Executive Coach

The People People Group — Mon, 16 Jan 2023 10:18:21 -0500

Regina Gerbeaux is the tactical, operations-driven coach for top-tier CEOs, operators, and investors. She is also a founder in interested in food tech, and an operator obsessed with putting structure to chaos. Previously, she was the COO at Mochary Method, Head of Operations at On Deck, and founder of a profitably-bootstrapped startup (sold in 2019).

Regina is passionate about helping people of the highest integrity build successful companies and solve some of the world’s most challenging problems. Her interests are in startups, sustainable company culture, stoicism, and using tech for positive social impact.

Regina open-sources all of her write-ups and templates online at https://www.coachingfounder.com/. Her tactical templates and operational write-ups have been referenced and used by fast-scaling companies including dYdX, BioRender, StageGlass, and many more.

For more reading, please visit https://www.coachingfounder.com/ and follow Regina on LinkedIn and Twitter.

From A People Perspective and The People People Group is made possible by our sponsors, if you're not a member, check out Canada's most engaged HR/Recruitment/Operations community.

Wavy is a culture management platform for flexible teams
The Leadership Agency is one of North America and the UK's best boutique startup recruitment agencies
SpringLaw is Canada's first (and best) virtual employment law firm

Shownotes:
(0:32) - Intro

(3:25) - Icebreakers

(7:50) - Finding Strength In Difficult Times

(13:10) - From Music To Teaching

(14:53) - Building A Business

(16:50) - Discovering Tech

(17:37) - Understanding Scaling

(18:51) - Starting A Company To Get Into School

(22:23) - Learning To Code

(23:54) - Life At OnDeck

(30:54) - OnDeck Fellowship

(41:53) - Success Contributors

(45:50) - What's Next

(48:30) - Misunderstanding People Ops

(55:08) - Fixing Culture

(57:25) - From A CEO's Perspective

(1:00:00) - Tightening Up Ops

(1:07:00) - RIFs With Compassion

(1:11:00) - Finding Good Leaders

(1:13:43) - Closing Remarks

Power Of Mentorship, Growth Marketing, Opportunity Costs And AI In Recruitment with Julian D'Angelo - Founder of Talin

The People People Group — Sat, 07 Jan 2023 11:58:10 -0500

Julian D'Angelo, the founder of Talin joins me on the podcast and we dive into his scrappy beginnings as an entrepreneur, the impact of mentorship, how recruitment is missing the boat on growth marketing and then go down the AI rabbit hole and it's impacts into recruitment.

From A People Perspective and The People People Group is made possible by our sponsors, if you're not a member, check out Canada's most engaged HR/Recruitment/Operations community.

Wavy is a culture management platform for flexible teams
The Leadership Agency is one of North America and the UK's best boutique startup recruitment agencies
SpringLaw is Canada's first (and best) virtual employment law firm

Shownotes:

(1:39) – Icebreakers
(5:38) – Teenage Side Hustles

(10:32) – Julian then and now

(16:37) – “ I do not believe in the concept of being self made…”

(18:27) – Mentorship received from Brent Stirling & the significance of mentorship

(24:28) – Founding Julian’s company, Talon

(31:17) – Growth marketing tools & the importance of personalization

(40:20) – Opportunity costs for Recruiters

(42:47) – AI, Chat GPT, benefits of AI use for Recruiters

(53:45) – Consequences of pessimistic outlook towards AI

(57:09) – Julian’s closing remarks

The Big Steps: Going International, Going Leadership And Going VC with Alison Kaizer - Global Recruitment Leader & Startup Advisor

The People People Group — Thu, 01 Dec 2022 22:31:04 -0500

The HR Podcast and startup veteran, Alison Kaizer graced the podcast with her knowledge on all things recruitment, leadership and figuring yourself out to figure everything else out. While she's no stranger to these conversations, she did save a few good stories and lots of wisdom for this episode.

From A People Perspective and The People People Group is made possible by our sponsors, if you're not a member, check out Canada's most engaged HR/Recruitment/Operations community.

Wavy is a culture management platform for flexible teams
The Leadership Agency is one of North America and the UK's best boutique startup recruitment agencies
SpringLaw is Canada's first (and best) virtual employment law firm

Shownotes:

(1:15) – Intro

(3:45) – Icebreakers!

(8:50) – The Journey Into Recruiting

(16:00) – Going International

(21:40) – Knowing Your Role

(23:30) – From Player To Coach

(26:35) – Getting Into VC

(31:25) – What's Next?

From A People Perspective is humbly hosted by Martin Hauck and perfectly produced by Krish Dineshkumar.

Opportunities In Space, Never Giving Up And Scaling From 2,000 To 14,000 with Aly Harji - Talent Leader

The People People Group — Wed, 26 Oct 2022 19:31:40 -0400

The energetic Aly Harji joined me on the podcast to LITERALLY INVITE YOU ON A CANADIAN ROCKETSHIP (almost literally) and while I had him on the line, we talked about how he broke into recruitment in tech and the lessons he learned from helping Shopify scale from 2,000 people to over 14,000 while he was the Talent Sourcing Manager for Commercial and Executive Search at Shopify.

From A People Perspective and The People People Group is made possible by our sponsors, if you're not a member, check out Canada's most engaged HR/Recruitment/Operations community.

Wavy is a culture management platform for flexible teams
The Leadership Agency is one of North America and the UK's best boutique startup recruitment agencies
SpringLaw is Canada's first (and best) virtual employment law firm

Here's the timestamps for the episode:
(2:15) – How they met.

(7:26) – What is SpaceRyde?

(13:00) – What talent is SpaceRyde looking for?

(15:00) – Is Spaceryde’s similar to SpaceX?

(17:15) – Aren’t you getting bored of Earth?

(19:30) – What is Spaceryde looking for in terms of talent?

(22:50) – How to get in touch with Aly! Email: Aly@spaceryde.com

(24:00) – Aly's origin story

(28:00) – Hospitality is a gateway to recruiting?!?!

(30:00) – Getting the opportunity

(32:30) – Transferrable skills

(35:25) – Value of experience from retail/hospitality; experiential learning

(36:55) – Aly’s journey to working for Shopify

(49:50) – Helping growing teams at different stages; startups, scale ups, enterprises…

(53:50) – Does hiring someone who interviews great for the position always translate to someone who performs incredibly well?

(58:05) – Importance of seeing how someone approaches their ‘craft’

(1:04:00) – Lessons from scaling up

(1:06:15) – Scaling vs. Flailing?

(1:07:50) – Aly's final thoughts... :heart:

From A People Perspective is humbly hosted by Martin Hauck and perfectly produced by Krish Dineshkumar.

Using Storytelling To Level Up Your Employer Brand with Marsha Shandur - Storytelling & Keynote Speaker Coach

The People People Group — Mon, 17 Jan 2022 21:03:07 -0500

Marsha Shandur and I talk about how to apply the science, magic and art of using storytelling to creating a captivating employer brand and levelling up the employee experience. Given that storytelling is the oldest form of communication, our brains are hardwired to respond better to those who communicate effectively.

Marsha has coached some of the most amazing speakers and helped countless organizations level up their communication skills, here's some of the wonderfully nice things they've said about working with her.

Marsha was kind enough to create a summary and resource page for some of the things we covered in the podcast and you can check that secret link here.

From A People Perspective and The People People Group is made possible by our sponsors, if you're not a member, check us out online, on LinkedIn, on Instagram or Twitter to learn more about North America's most engaged people operations community.

Wavy is a culture management platform for flexible teams
The Leadership Agency is one of North America and the UK's best boutique startup recruitment agencies
SpringLaw is Canada's first (and best) virtual employment law firm

Hosted by Martin Hauck and produced by Krish Dineshkumar

Diving Deep Into Recruiting For Tech with Mike Bettley - Director of Talent Acquisition

The People People Group — Fri, 20 Nov 2020 22:15:53 -0500

Mike Bettley shares his journey in recruitment, starting from a sales-focused recruitment agency to working at Google and then transitioning to smaller companies. He emphasizes the importance of recruitment in solving business problems and the need for transparency in the decision-making process. He also discusses the challenges and potential drawbacks of remote work and the importance of understanding the unique needs and culture of each organization when hiring. In this conversation, Martin Hauck discusses the importance of maintaining integrity in the hiring process and the need to constantly work on normalizing a high conversion rate. He emphasizes the value of incorporating a sense of ownership in the talent acquisition process and acknowledges the reality that employees may not stay with a company for a long time. Martin also highlights the significance of metrics in recruiting and the need to analyze and infer from them to improve effectiveness. He encourages talent leaders to have a business owner mindset and to understand the perspective of their CEO and other leaders in order to make a greater impact.

A Candid Candidate Conversation with Andrew Tan - Brand Strategy Consultant

The People People Group — Thu, 29 Oct 2020 19:12:53 -0400

Andrew Tan and I dive into the multi-faceted challenges of being new to a country and finding work despite having an excellent educational background and a robust list of work experience.

Assessing Leadership Skills with Jamie Hoobanoff - Founder of The Leadership Agency

The People People Group — Mon, 12 Oct 2020 20:31:19 -0400

Jamie Hoobanoff, Founder of The Leadership Agency answers a few questions raised that members of The People People Group had on assessing skills when it comes to leaders.