Main Topics

• The journey and milestones of "Dancing with Depression" podcast
• The role of personal stories and diverse perspectives in mental health awareness
• Practical insights from organizations like NAMI Charlotte, Mission 22, and Hopeway
• A few things I’ve learned along the way
• The importance of testing, evaluation, and medication in mental health management
• Future plans: more personal stories, expert interviews, and community engagement

Resources & Links

• NAMI Charlotte
• Mission 22
• Hopeway

Connect with Adam

• Email: dancingwithdepression@yahoo.com

In this episode:

• The origin story of Mission 22 and how discarded metal created art that symbolizes hope and tragedy
• Why the number 22 represents the daily veteran suicides and what the organization hopes to change
• The psychological parallels between combat trauma and civilian life, including the importance of community and bonds
• How veterans can repurpose their warrior traits into new ventures like entrepreneurship, yoga, or advocacy
• The role of coaching versus therapy in supporting veteran mental health and personal growth
• The significance of family support and addressing the relational impacts of veteran trauma
• Examples of veteran success stories, including founders of businesses and community projects
• Practical ways to get involved with Mission 22: programs, ambassador opportunities, retreats, and resources

Resources & Links:

• Mission 22 Official Website
• The Resiliency Podcast - Mission 22
• On Sheeps, Sheepdogs, and Wolves Essay 

Support the mission:

• Liking, sharing, or leaving a review of this episode helps spread awareness.
• Volunteer or participate in programs through mission22.org.
• Consider becoming an ambassador or joining veteran athlete initiatives.

Remember:

Asking for help today enables you to be the support for others tomorrow. Your healing journey can inspire and uplift those around you—reach out, connect, and don't do it alone.

Episode Disclaimer
This episode of Dancing With Depression includes conversations about mental health that may be sensitive for some listeners. Listener discretion is advised. The content shared reflects personal experiences and perspectives and is not a substitute for professional mental health care. If you are in crisis or need immediate support, call or text 988 to reach the Suicide & Crisis Lifeline. For non-emergency support and resources, contact the NAMI HelpLine at 1-800-950-NAMI (6264).

Main Topics: 

• The transformative power of childhood trauma and its lasting impact
• How avoidance behaviors develop and influence adult decisions
• The role of unprocessed memories in shaping mental health
• Recognizing triggers rooted in early life experiences
• Practical steps for revisiting and healing from past events

Key Insights: 

• A near-drowning incident at age seven triggered a lifelong rule of avoiding water
• Childhood memories can reinforce negative beliefs and behaviors well into adulthood
• The importance of questioning and revisiting childhood rules to challenge limiting beliefs
• How external stories, like media stories, can activate unprocessed childhood fears
• Strategies for awareness and healing through reflection on early experiences
• The relevance of mental health conversations rooted in childhood memories
• The significance of being present and conscious of reactions linked to past traumas

Episode Disclaimer
This episode of Dancing With Depression includes conversations about mental health that may be sensitive for some listeners. Listener discretion is advised. The content shared reflects personal experiences and perspectives and is not a substitute for professional mental health care. If you are in crisis or need immediate support, call or text 988 to reach the Suicide & Crisis Lifeline. For non-emergency support and resources, contact the NAMI HelpLine at 1-800-950-NAMI (6264).

Together, they explore the roles of labels, internal struggles, childhood innocence, and the courage required to break free and live authentically.

In this episode:

• Allison's childhood experiences with labels and societal expectations
• The internal conflict between achievement and true passion
• How childhood innocence and light can be dimmed by adult conditioning
• The significance of questioning societal roles and internalized expectations
• The process of identifying and releasing limiting labels (smart, good daughter, etc.)
• Challenges faced during early college years and health crises
• The journey from performing for others to living for oneself
• Practical tools: labeling exercises and strategies to unlearn imposed identities
• The importance of creating safe spaces for children and adults to just be
• Personal best practices for managing heavy emotions: crying, sleeping, writing, and presence

Resources & Links:

• My Green Lab — Nonprofit promoting sustainability in labs
• TED Talk (2019) – Our little world — Allison's impactful speech on unseen emotional weights
• The Mistake – by Allison Paradise (Find on Amazon.com)

This episode encourages you to reflect on the labels you carry and empowers you to take steps toward living your authentic life, honoring your inner light, and creating safe spaces for growth—inside and out.

Episode Disclaimer
This episode of Dancing With Depression includes conversations about mental health that may be sensitive for some listeners. Listener discretion is advised. The content shared reflects personal experiences and perspectives and is not a substitute for professional mental health care. If you are in crisis or need immediate support, call or text 988 to reach the Suicide & Crisis Lifeline. For non-emergency support and resources, contact the NAMI HelpLine at 1-800-950-NAMI (6264).

Takeaways:

• NAMI Charlotte's mission is centered around connection.
• The Resource Center serves as a vital hub for community support.
• The NAMI Navigator program helps individuals find mental health resources.
• Support groups provide a safe space for sharing experiences.
• Education is key to understanding mental health issues.
• Connection is crucial for those on a mental health journey.
• NAMI Charlotte offers both in-person and virtual support groups.
• The organization aims to reduce stigma around mental health.
• Community partnerships enhance the resources available to individuals.
• Spreading awareness is essential for improving mental health outcomes.

Episode Disclaimer
This episode of Dancing With Depression includes conversations about mental health that may be sensitive for some listeners. Listener discretion is advised. The content shared reflects personal experiences and perspectives and is not a substitute for professional mental health care. If you are in crisis or need immediate support, call or text 988 to reach the Suicide & Crisis Lifeline. For non-emergency support and resources, contact the NAMI HelpLine at 1-800-950-NAMI (6264).

• The words we choose can lock us in place or leave space for growth.
• Absolutes in language can turn moments into identities.
• When we say 'never' or 'always', we often express overwhelming emotions.
• Understanding the context of our words is crucial in relationships.
• Healing involves recognizing that feelings are valid but not permanent. Language shapes behavior, which in turn shapes outcomes.
• It's important to ask what someone means rather than correcting their words.
• The journey of healing is reflected in the evolution of our language.
• Support and understanding are key in navigating mental health challenges.
• Community engagement can amplify the message of hope and understanding.

Episode Disclaimer
This episode of Dancing With Depression includes conversations about mental health that may be sensitive for some listeners. Listener discretion is advised. The content shared reflects personal experiences and perspectives and is not a substitute for professional mental health care. If you are in crisis or need immediate support, call or text 988 to reach the Suicide & Crisis Lifeline. For non-emergency support and resources, contact the NAMI HelpLine at 1-800-950-NAMI (6264).

Takeaways

• Mark's military background shaped his perspective on life.
• The importance of camaraderie in the military is profound.
• Transitioning to civilian life can be challenging for veterans.
• Mental health awareness has improved but still needs attention.
• Connection with others is crucial for mental well-being.
• Experiencing loss can lead to deeper reflections on life.
• Leadership lessons from the military can apply to civilian roles.
• Understanding different perspectives is key to personal growth.
• Support systems play a vital role in overcoming challenges.
• It's important to take the first step towards seeking help.

Episode Disclaimer
This episode of Dancing With Depression includes conversations about mental health that may be sensitive for some listeners. Listener discretion is advised. The content shared reflects personal experiences and perspectives and is not a substitute for professional mental health care. If you are in crisis or need immediate support, call or text 988 to reach the Suicide & Crisis Lifeline. For non-emergency support and resources, contact the NAMI HelpLine at 1-800-950-NAMI (6264).

Takeaways

• Mark's military background shaped his perspective on life.
• The importance of camaraderie in the military is profound.
• Transitioning to civilian life can be challenging for veterans.
• Mental health awareness has improved but still needs attention.
• Connection with others is crucial for mental well-being.
• Experiencing loss can lead to deeper reflections on life.
• Leadership lessons from the military can apply to civilian roles.
• Understanding different perspectives is key to personal growth.
• Support systems play a vital role in overcoming challenges.
• It's important to take the first step towards seeking help.

Episode Disclaimer
This episode of Dancing With Depression includes conversations about mental health that may be sensitive for some listeners. Listener discretion is advised. The content shared reflects personal experiences and perspectives and is not a substitute for professional mental health care. If you are in crisis or need immediate support, call or text 988 to reach the Suicide & Crisis Lifeline. For non-emergency support and resources, contact the NAMI HelpLine at 1-800-950-NAMI (6264).

Takeaways

• Mark's military background shaped his perspective on life.
• The importance of camaraderie in the military is profound.
• Transitioning to civilian life can be challenging for veterans.
• Mental health awareness has improved but still needs attention.
• Connection with others is crucial for mental well-being.
• Experiencing loss can lead to deeper reflections on life.
• Leadership lessons from the military can apply to civilian roles.
• Understanding different perspectives is key to personal growth.
• Support systems play a vital role in overcoming challenges.
• It's important to take the first step towards seeking help.

Episode Disclaimer
This episode of Dancing With Depression includes conversations about mental health that may be sensitive for some listeners. Listener discretion is advised. The content shared reflects personal experiences and perspectives and is not a substitute for professional mental health care. If you are in crisis or need immediate support, call or text 988 to reach the Suicide & Crisis Lifeline. For non-emergency support and resources, contact the NAMI HelpLine at 1-800-950-NAMI (6264).

Takeaways

• Evaluations provide clarity, not judgment.
• Understanding oneself is key to effective support.
• Testing is about learning how your unique brain works.
• The evaluation process is a journey of self-discovery.
• Common reasons for seeking evaluations include feeling stuck or overwhelmed.
• Neurodiversity affirming approaches focus on strengths, not deficits.
• There is no wrong time to pursue an evaluation.
• Misconceptions about testing can create unnecessary fear.
• Therapy helps cope; assessments help understand.
• Developing a personal toolkit is essential for managing mental health.

Chapters
00:00 Introduction to Dr. Lauren Goldstein
04:28 Common Reasons for Seeking Evaluations
08:24 Breaking Points: When Adults Seek Testing
11:45 Moving from Uncertainty to Clarity
13:44 Creating a Roadmap for Support
16:01 Misconceptions About Testing and Evaluations
18:58 When is the Right Time for an Evaluation?
20:51 Neurodiversity Affirming Approach Explained
25:23 Understanding How You Think and Learn
26:10 Considering the Value of Evaluations
26:33 Preparing for the Evaluation Process
27:39 Assessment vs. Therapy: Understanding the Difference
28:21 Knowing When to Pause and Reflect
29:00 Sorting Out Underlying Issues
30:57 Using Assessment Results for Tailored Treatment
31:24 Real-Life Impact of Accurate Diagnoses
34:12 Encouragement for Those Feeling Stuck
34:59 Developing Your Own Coping Toolkit
37:31 Personal Reflections on ADHD Diagnosis
42:32 Conclusion and Final Thoughts

Episode Disclaimer
This episode of Dancing With Depression includes conversations about mental health that may be sensitive for some listeners. Listener discretion is advised. The content shared reflects personal experiences and perspectives and is not a substitute for professional mental health care. If you are in crisis or need immediate support, call or text 988 to reach the Suicide & Crisis Lifeline. For non-emergency support and resources, contact the NAMI HelpLine at 1-800-950-NAMI (6264).

Takeaways

• Growth creates distance, and perspective shapes meaning.
• Help is most effective when timing and readiness align.
• People may not be ready to share their stories, even if they care.
• Timing matters in all areas of life, not just mental health.
• Resistance often reflects a difference in processing time.
• Sharing stories can honor lives rather than reopen wounds.
• Pain, comfort, and healing are deeply personal experiences.
• We can't decide how others will experience something, but we can offer them the
• chance.
• Healing happens when experience, time, and perspective meet.
• Supporting others means walking beside them, not rushing ahead.

Chapters
00:00 The Importance of Timing and Perspective
03:00 Understanding Readiness in Conversations
07:20 The Role of Perspective in Healing
10:30 Supporting Others on Their Journey

Episode Disclaimer
This episode of Dancing With Depression includes conversations about mental health that may be sensitive for some listeners. Listener discretion is advised. The content shared reflects personal experiences and perspectives and is not a substitute for professional mental health care. If you are in crisis or need immediate support, call or text 988 to reach the Suicide & Crisis Lifeline. For non-emergency support and resources, contact the NAMI HelpLine at 1-800-950-NAMI (6264).

Okay, before we go down memory lane, I want to set the stage for today's conversation. If you've never been to therapy before, or if you've considered going, but weren't sure what to expect, this episode is designed for you. We're going to break down what the first session really looks like. So, you can feel a little more at ease with them.

a process that just typically is kind of uncomfortable at first. What's cool is you're going to hear it from both sides, my perspective as a client, which I still want to refer to as a patient, but anyways, who has had that experience. And then we're also going to get the perspective of an expert, Giselle, who guides people through this.

pretty much every day. So speaking of experts, I'm joined by someone who played an important role in my own personal mental health journey. She holds a Master of Science and is a licensed marriage and family therapist, Giselle Schockett.

Thanks for having me, Adam.

It’s great to see you. We want to talk a little bit about what that first appointment or scheduling is like but before we dive in, can you share just a little bit about your professional background
What ultimately led you into this line of work?

Okay, so I've been in private practice for 28 years and I started out as an intern going through my master's program at a pastoral counseling center. That's where I got my start and from there, I think I worked there for about five years.

While I was working towards my licensure because you must get a certain number of client face-to-face hours to sit for the board to get your license and then Unfortunately that pastoral counseling center went out of business. So, one of my colleagues and I went and opened our own practice. And we were very fortunate, of course, because we were able to take a lot of those clients with us. So that was nice. I also have worked in emergency departments.
three of them for, I no longer work in emergency departments, but I worked in three of them for about 20 years at the same time as I was doing private practice. And that is an entirely different situation and a wonderful way to get experience with every mental health issue you can imagine. I really, really enjoy that. And, now I'm just in private practice and kind of easing into retirement, I want to say to anyone who's listening that this is my first time doing a podcast and I am scared to death so I want anyone to understand that Everything new is scary And you just have to take that leap of faith and take the first step and make that phone call and if someone doesn't call you back that unfortunately doesn't mean anything is wrong with you it means that they're not giving good customer service that's all that means so make the next phone call go down your list and find someone that either answers
So as far as how I got to doing therapy, think you'll probably find that no one gets into this business without having their own story. And we all have our own story. I grew up in a very dysfunctional family. I was the youngest of five and never felt like I had a voice around the house. There was a lot of, didn't suffer physical abuse, but my brothers did. And I just always felt like I needed to understand why, how someone could be so awful to another person. And so that was a big part of it. And then when I was probably around eighth grade, I had a traumatic experience where I was chased by some men in a...box truck and that was really scary for me and so my mother took me to therapy and while I don't remember really anything about it I just know it didn't work for me. It was I didn't feel comfortable; the person didn't make me comfortable and so that was something else that I wanted to make sure the people I saw were very comfortable like it was almost you know in your living room talking over a cup of coffee. And that's kind of how I've done my practice.

And that translated. Because, you know, I felt that I didn't know the backstory. didn't know how you got into, you know, being a therapist, but I did feel like at times we were just sitting there chopping it up. and so that was nice. And that really is kind of dynamic. As you mentioned you were young. Not that you went to therapy quote unquote against your will, but you didn't really know what was going on. I went willingly, even though I kind of was misled, but we'll talk about that later on. So that really being the part is you know, what should someone expect or can they expect going into their first therapy session from your knowledge? What would you like them to think?

Well, I think currently technology has changed from when I first started. Now, generally, think people send a packet over the internet and you fill out your history and why you're coming and that kind of thing. So, we have a head start on how to structure the first visit.

That can make it a little more clinical than I prefer it to be because it's almost like we just jump in instead of just being kind of an organic learning about you and what's going on in your life. But so, we gen, I don't know if that's across the United States that therapists do that, but that's how I operate my business. You will get a list of questions to answer.

Okay.

And then when you come in, I just talk about, first I try and make you at ease, you know, of course, because just like I am today, very nervous. You are going to be nervous if it's your first time going into a therapist's office. So, it's a time for you to interview the therapist as well as a therapist to understand you a little bit to make sure that they have the specialty to meet your needs. So, I think one of the things I want people to understand is that it's not somewhere where you're going to be judged at all. It's somewhere where you can have a conversation and you have 50 minutes, 45 minutes, an hour where someone is just paying attention to you without distractions.

And it's probably the first time in our lives that we're doing that because there's always distractions. So that's one of the things I really enjoy about therapy is it's just one-on-one or in my case, I'm a marriage and family therapist. So, it could be a family, but we're just there together really connecting.

And you talked about, you know, wanting to kind of set the stage of being comfortable and such. Are there any techniques or things that you do specifically as you're sitting across from someone or even, you know, if you're doing telehealth and maybe you're picking up that they're nervous, you're picking up different sizes. Is there anything specific that you do to help them?

Well, people tell me that I do make them feel at ease. And I think that's because I know what it was like for me to go into this office with someone who was going to read my mind or something, I think I thought at first when I was younger. And it's intimidating, right? You're telling, you're pretty…eventually your, you know, your most inner thoughts and that is I take that as a very humbling experience for me. I value that people are willing to share things that they wouldn't share with, maybe even their best friend. So, I take that very seriously. I also try and bring in humor.

will tell them that, for instance, my mother told me everybody wasn't going to like me. And that is certainly the case. And that's okay, you know, we're not everybody's cup of tea. And if I'm not the right fit for you, go somewhere else, and I will help you go somewhere else. I will not take offense to that. And I think I hope that other thera...

Takeaways

• This isn't a story about failed relationships.
• Experience alone doesn't equal growth. Awareness does.
• What patterns have shown up more than once in your relationships?
• I wasn't incapable of connecting, just immature.
• I wanted to help or take their pain away.
• Therapy isn't about taking advice from someone who's been there.
• This relationship wasn't shaky due to a breakdown in communication.
• I needed someone to help me see myself clearly.
• Sometimes the hardest step is simply showing up.
• Take the lead when it comes to depression.

Episode Disclaimer
This episode of Dancing With Depression includes conversations about mental health that may be sensitive for some listeners. Listener discretion is advised. The content shared reflects personal experiences and perspectives and is not a substitute for professional mental health care. If you are in crisis or need immediate support, call or text 988 to reach the Suicide & Crisis Lifeline. For non-emergency support and resources, contact the NAMI HelpLine at 1-800-950-NAMI (6264).

Takeaways

• Katie experienced panic attacks that disrupted her life.
• She sought help from therapists and psychiatrists.
• Her journey included a stay at a behavioral health facility.
• Hopeway provided a supportive community for healing.
• Katie's family struggled to understand her mental health challenges.
• She emphasizes the importance of self-care and coping strategies.
• Katie found joy in serving her community post-treatment.
• She advocates for mental health awareness and support.
• Katie learned that feelings of depression are not permanent.
• Her experience has opened conversations about mental health in her family.

Episode Disclaimer
This episode of Dancing With Depression includes conversations about mental health that may be sensitive for some listeners. Listener discretion is advised. The content shared reflects personal experiences and perspectives and is not a substitute for professional mental health care. If you are in crisis or need immediate support, call or text 988 to reach the Suicide & Crisis Lifeline. For non-emergency support and resources, contact the NAMI HelpLine at 1-800-950-NAMI (6264).

Takeaways

• Group therapy creates a sense of warmth and connection.
• CBT focuses on the interconnection of thoughts, feelings, and behaviors.
• DBT emphasizes acceptance and change in emotional responses.
• Therapy requires personal connection for effective healing.
• Awareness of cognitive distortions is crucial in therapy.
• Progress in therapy is subjective and varies for each individual.
• Distress tolerance skills are often more accessible than emotion regulation skills.
• Mindfulness is a key component of DBT and overall mental health.
• Therapy can help individuals feel less alone in their struggles.
• Seeking help is a sign of strength and worthiness.

Episode Disclaimer
This episode of Dancing With Depression includes conversations about mental health that may be sensitive for some listeners. Listener discretion is advised. The content shared reflects personal experiences and perspectives and is not a substitute for professional mental health care. If you are in crisis or need immediate support, call or text 988 to reach the Suicide & Crisis Lifeline. For non-emergency support and resources, contact the NAMI HelpLine at 1-800-950-NAMI (6264).

Takeaways

• Mental health discussions are crucial for understanding personal struggles.
• Family dynamics play a significant role in mental health.
• Support systems are vital during times of illness.
• Resilience can be built through shared experiences and challenges.
• Marriage requires ongoing effort and communication to thrive.
• Recognizing signs of depression can be difficult amidst daily responsibilities.
• Therapy and counseling can provide valuable tools for couples.
• Personal reflections can lead to greater self-awareness and healing.
• It's important to express feelings and maintain open communication with loved ones.
• Shared experiences can foster deeper connections and understanding.

Episode Disclaimer
This episode of Dancing With Depression includes conversations about mental health that may be sensitive for some listeners. Listener discretion is advised. The content shared reflects personal experiences and perspectives and is not a substitute for professional mental health care. If you are in crisis or need immediate support, call or text 988 to reach the Suicide & Crisis Lifeline. For non-emergency support and resources, contact the NAMI HelpLine at 1-800-950-NAMI (6264).

Takeaways

• I felt overwhelmed by work and relationships.
• I stopped taking my prescribed medication cold turkey.
• I didn't want to stay in sales for over a decade.
• I finally decided to reach out for help.
• I filled out my paperwork for group therapy.
• I learned about CBT and DBT in therapy.
• I had to try different ADHD meds to concentrate.
• I was calm leading up to my return to work.
• Returning to work isn't the end of healing.
• It's okay to wobble a little bit during the journey.

Episode Disclaimer
This episode of Dancing With Depression includes conversations about mental health that may be sensitive for some listeners. Listener discretion is advised. The content shared reflects personal experiences and perspectives and is not a substitute for professional mental health care. If you are in crisis or need immediate support, call or text 988 to reach the Suicide & Crisis Lifeline. For non-emergency support and resources, contact the NAMI HelpLine at 1-800-950-NAMI (6264).

On July 22nd, I felt like I was drowning at work. Now, I'm sure we've all felt overwhelmed before. You know, that feeling of spinning your wheels, crossing one thing off of your to-do list, only to have three more things show up.

But this felt different. Everyday responsibilities, mounting stress, and the weight of trying to hold it all together, it just became too much. And I couldn't see the light at the end of the tunnel.

The next day, July 23rd.

I found myself sitting with my psychiatrist and after that conversation, I made the decision that I've never made before. I submitted a claim for short-term disability.

I didn't fully understand what that even meant or what came next.

I didn't fully understand what that meant or even what came next. I just knew one thing for sure. The way I was living wasn't working.

My hope was that some time away from work might just help me catch my breath. You know, maybe reset. How? I had no clue.

I just knew I couldn't keep going the way I was.

As I started planning what time away would look like, both my psychiatrist and therapist suggested something I hadn't even considered. A mental health clinic. Now that was definitely not part of my plan.

Mostly because let's be honest, I didn't have one. So I did what most of us do when we're unsure of something. I did a Google search. And it was like I was choosing a restaurant while on vacation. And I went straight to the reviews. The clinic that had been recommended had received a 3.6 out of five stars, with 113 reviews, which I felt was a significant amount to gauge what kind of facility this would be.

Now, I don't know about you, but I tend to jump straight to the bad reviews so that one, I could determine if it was worth going any further. But I also, think, was subconsciously building my exit strategy as to why this wouldn't be a good fit. But I read probably 10 different reviews.

And I realized that there wasn't anything that consistently stood out. There were some challenges I'm sure people experience, but they seem to be very isolated. And many of them were about the food not being that great. That's. Wasn't going to be strong enough for me to to say no. And. I always remind myself that especially when you're reading other people's experiences and reviews that there's always two sides to every story and the truth usually lands somewhere in between.

So I decided to move on and check out the website, learn a little bit more about the different programs that they had to offer. And I read they had three options. The first one was residential. The second one was PHP. And the third one was IOP. So the website breaks down what each of those programs consist of and

Essentially, the residential program is that of what it sounds. You're living on their facility, which happens to be in 30 minutes away from where I am. But you're there for 30 days and you are in full day group therapy. You have weekly psychiatrist and therapist sessions, and then they have weekend activities like yoga or journaling or ARP. The second option was PHP, which is partial hospitalization. Again, you're going to their facility. It's a structured day, so you're there from 9 o'clock in the morning till 4 in the afternoon, Monday through Friday. But you go home. And the third option is IOP, which is intensive outpatient. It's much more flexible.

I learned later on that a lot of people step down and kind of use the IOP to transition from a residential program into kind of going back into their normal routine. The way I viewed IOP was I could still be at home and that was what was comfortable for me. My initial reaction with regards to residential was no way. And the funny part was I said to myself, I'm not mentally ready for residential. Yeah, not mentally ready for mental health treatment.

Sounds ridiculous, but this is also the same guy that admitted that he stopped taking all of his medications cold turkey. So. That's where I was at. I landed on IOP. As I mentioned, it felt like the safest choice. I could be in my own home and honestly. I didn't go in with big expectations or goals on what I was hoping to get from therapy, I just knew that I had to do something.

And like everything within the medical or healthcare systems, there was forms that I had to fill out. There was screenings and evaluations to ensure that I could benefit from the program. And eventually I did end up getting the call that I had been accepted and I was scheduled to start August 15th at 9 a.m.

In the days leading up to that, my mind was racing and asking questions like, is this really happening? Is this going to help me?

How did I even get here? But first day came and those questions shifted from curiosity to a full on panic.

I remember logging into the zoom call. And I use zoom for work all the time, so I'm very comfortable with it. But this. This was different. You see at work. Everyone centered in their frame. They have good lighting. Polished backgrounds, whether they have like a blur or a background of a place that they want to go to and you can't see everything in the background. This call started off very differently. People were laying down in their bed. Cameras were pointing up at the ceiling. Someone was on a hike. Another person was folding their laundry.

And I couldn't help but think to myself, what the hell have I gotten myself into?

Glanced at the clock. It was 906 a.m.

And I just told myself, just get through the next two hours and 54 minutes. And we can try and figure out where to go from here. But I certainly didn't think it was going to be another session.

And then the clinician welcomed everyone. And asked if anyone had something that they wanted to process.

And I remember my therapist saying to me that it's okay to just listen for a while. Don't feel like you have to participate until you're ready if you're ready. And someone started to share.

And I remember shortly after that saying, think this is going to be helpful and looking at the clock and seeing that it was 9.10.

It's amazing what four minutes can do.

So of course...

So what changed? Well, I think first and foremost, I took a step back. I let my guard down and instead of focusing on all of these things that were different, with how they looked and their cameras and distractions everywhere, I realized that I was that person just in a different setting.

There were days that I didn't get out of bed.

There were days, not days like in a day, like multiple days where I didn't take a shower. And I was hiding from essentially being seen.

These folks were brave enough to turn their cameras on and give what they had.

And so...

I started to see the similarities as opposed to the differences.

And those differences weren't even between me and other people. was environment wise, work versus group ther...

I want to start with a quick update on where I stand after several months of being off my anxiety and depression medication. I’m happy to say that some small but meaningful improvements have shown up—I’m taking more showers, and when my laundry is done drying, I actually fold it and put it away. Small wins matter.

But it hasn’t all been easy. Anxiety still creeps in—especially at work—and depression still rears its ugly head. The toughest part is, I rarely recognize it in the moment. For example, not too long ago, I told Bobbie I was thinking about selling everything in my man cave—my vinyl records, my favorite movie posters, and even my sports jerseys. Bobbie gently asked if it was really what I wanted, or if it was my depression talking. After some reflection, I realized she was right—it was depression.

That moment connects to another experience I had while listening to music. A lyric jumped out at me: “But I can’t be your only remedy; tryin’ to save you, gon’ kill me.” It’s from the song “Dear Alcohol” by Dax, with that line sung by Carly Pearl in the remix. If you haven’t heard it, go check it out—you won’t be disappointed. That lyric stood out to me because of a specific conversation Bobbie and I had just a few weeks prior. 

Which brings me to today’s episode. What you’re about to hear is a conversation between Bobbie & I, which took place two months after the initial conversation where Bobbie so accurately describes it as “Giving it to me…” a very difficult—but necessary—moment where Bobbie shared where she was in our relationship: what she was missing, and what she needed if I couldn’t provide it. It was one of the hardest things I’ve ever had to listen to, but it was also honest and truthful. And yes, it happened on my birthday—but for me, that was just a coincidence that showed how important it was for her to get it out.

So, with that context, let’s jump in.

In the last episode, I invited you to walk in my shoes as I shared what it was like to stop taking medication cold turkey. This time, I want to turn things around. Today, I invite you to walk in the shoes of my wife, Bobbie. She’ll be sharing her perspective on what it’s like to live with—and love—someone with a mental health diagnosis. She’ll talk about the challenges she’s faced, what she needed in order to keep supporting me, and how she decided whether our foundation was strong enough to withstand the tornado of my anxiety and depression.

Before we begin, let me tell you a little about Bobbie. She spends her days caring for patients as a dental hygienist. Now, I know some of you might cringe just thinking about going to the dentist, but trust me—there’s something different, something special, about Bobbie’s abilities. And I’m not just saying that because I’m her husband. The patient reviews back it up. And besides, I’m not just her husband—I’m also her patient.

Over our 9 ½ years of marriage, one thing has become clear: Bobbie doesn’t speak just to fill the silence. When she shares something, it’s because she’s thought it through. So when she told me she had something important to share, I knew I needed to pay attention.

And the truth is, Bobbie’s knowledge in this area has always been ahead of mine. While I can clear out a sports-related Jeopardy category, she’s the one who has the science and chemistry answers locked down. I still can’t pronounce half of the prescriptions I’ve been on, but she sounds like a pharmacist.

Her compassion and understanding carried us far, but eventually, she reached a point where she needed to ask me directly: was I going to stay in survival mode, or was I ready to put in the work—for us?

This is that conversation, recorded two months after that pivotal moment. Let’s listen.
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Start of audio DWD S2 E3 – A Partners Perspective 2 of 3

I think you mean what happened that I decided to have the conversation. What put me over the edge. don't know what put me over the edge, but I just felt like I care about our relationship and if it was gonna continue, it couldn't continue to go on the way that it was. I couldn't continue like we were and I care enough that I wanna address it and not let it die. And so we're obviously addressing my anxiety and depression and you know, I think we've talked about this, that we show what we want to show. And there's things that you're dealing with that I might not have realized in the moment. So what are some of the things that you deal with? ⁓ The conversation was just a check-in. I think if you are not open and honest with your partner, then you don't really have a relationship. So if I'm not telling you how I feel...

What are we doing? And it was kind of where I was at. I couldn't continue to do what, quote, we were doing, because we weren't doing. I was struggling alone, trying to hold everything in, because you were dealing with stuff. And I didn't want to put my stuff on you and make things worse.

But at the same time, if you're not checking in with your partner, then you're essentially abandoning them. It's everybody's responsibility as part of a partnership to be there and be honest and be open. And I just felt like I couldn't do it anymore. I was struggling with my own independence and trying to meet your needs and your desires of how things go financially and autonomy and all different kinds of things in a relationship and I feel like I'm a pretty independent person and I'm probably not as nice as I should be and not as thoughtful and I just want to do what I want to do so it takes a lot of work to be a good partner the one that I would want for myself and the one that I would want you to have, the one that you deserve. So on your birthday, I decided to tell you how horrible our relationship was in the current state. We joke, I mean, we laugh about it, but I think, you know, I think the most, one of the most important things is this happened on a day that was my birthday, but it's not how it's planned, right? It's just, that's when it came to a boil. It wasn't like you woke up and you're like, you know what? How can I find a way to screw his birthday up? Just a background. mean, I did something that I wasn't supposed to do and I had to live with my actions. I went and asserted my own personal beliefs about using a credit card and buying something that I wanted, that I value because I was in a bad place emotionally.

I needed to assert myself. I needed to do what I needed to do to survive. And it's not the way that you're comfortable using credit cards. And I know that. And we're a partnership. So we're not supposed to do anything that makes the other uncomfortable. But I felt like it was an act of survival for me to do that and go against you and not care that you didn't like it and to tell you that I did it against your wishes because I needed to do it for me in order to survive in that moment.

And I needed you to push back. That's what I think a lot of people are missing. If you're not sharing and you're not open and you're not honest, sometimes you just need to feel like you're not alone. Fast forward, I returned of my own volition all of the jewelry. I undid what I did and I didn't do it for you. I did it because I was taking care of myself.

And I needed to figure out why I was feeling like I needed to do that for myself.

I ruined your birthday and we went on and we had a fabulous birthday but I found you again. I lost you. You weren't with me. I wasn't sharing with you because I was trying to protect you from all t...

Before we begin, I want to make something very clear: these are my personal experiences. If you or someone you know is struggling with mental health, please seek professional help. You can call 1-800-950-NAMI (that’s 1-800-950-6264) or text NAMI to 62640. You're not alone, and there are people who care and want to help.

There’s a saying that I think is the perfect framework for this episode:

“Don’t judge someone until you’ve walked in their shoes.”

So, today, I invite you to walk in mine.

----

The Decision

A few months ago, I made a decision—not recommended by a professional, not thought out, and definitely not the smartest one in my 49 years on this earth—to stop all of my medication. Yup, cold turkey.

And when I say “all,” I mean ALL:

• My anxiety and depression medication
• My diabetes medication
• My cholesterol medication

Let me pause and give you a second to ask the question that everyone asks me when I tell them this:
“Why?”
“What were you thinking?”

And my honest answer is:
I don’t know.

I just knew I was tired of feeling like a numb little bug. Of going through life like a robot. Sure, the medication was working—it was helping my anxiety and depression—but I didn’t feel like myself. I wasn’t folding laundry, wasn’t showering regularly, wasn’t picking up the phone to call people I love. I wanted to do these things, I had internal conversations about doing these things, I even said how beneficial they would be…but no action followed.

Even joy started feeling… muted.

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The Crash

The first sign something was wrong? I was keeping myself awake until I couldn’t keep my eyes open any longer. I’ve always been a night owl, but this was different. I’d be up at 2, 3, 4 a.m., not because I was energized—but because I was trying to keep my brain busy until it just gave out. I didn’t want to be alone with my thoughts.

And here’s where I need to tread carefully. The thoughts I was having were about death, but not suicide. I was struggling with the concept of life and death—grappling with existence itself. It's hard to explain, and maybe I’ll try in another episode once I can wrap my brain around it a little better. But it was scary, and heavy, and consuming. 

I’d like to add that this moment was part of my crash, and if I had chosen not to share it, only a select few would have known. But not everyone has that luxury.

Society today is quick to pull out a phone and record a developing situation, hoping it “goes viral.” Maybe this name rings a bell, maybe it doesn’t—but what comes to mind when I say Delonte West?

Delonte West was a professional basketball player in the NBA. He played for the Dallas Mavericks, Boston Celtics, and Cleveland Cavaliers, earning just over $16 million over the course of eight seasons. His story perfectly reflects the saying, “Don’t judge someone until you’ve walked in their shoes.”

In 2022, a video of Delonte West went viral showing the former NBA player panhandling in a gas station parking lot. The overwhelming majority of the comments focused on how much money he had made during his career, as if being an NBA player somehow protected him from “being human.” People judged him without knowing he was battling addiction and had been diagnosed with bipolar disorder.

We have access to an endless amount of information, yet we still haven’t mastered the ability to understand what is happening in someone’s life—much less why it’s happening.

We have to do better. I encourage you to do better…

----

A Glimmer of Good

Now, I won’t say there weren’t any positives. The biggest one?
I was reintroduced to my emotions. I cried when watching the video of a soldier come home and surprising his family. You know the ones I’m talking about….– I ugly cried watching the Disney/Pixar movie - Inside Out – nothing like a good cry!

That emotion had been missing for years, often times I questioned if it would ever reappear. It did & I’m glad!

And I’ve restarted my diabetes and cholesterol meds. 

----

The Ripple Effect

What I didn’t realize at the time was how much this decision impacted not just me—but everyone around me.

1. Work

Let’s start with work. In sales, hitting quota isn’t just about personal pride—it directly affects your manager’s income. When I stopped my meds, my performance dropped. I missed my quota for months.

Many managers would’ve written me off. “Burnout,” they’d say. Or “maybe he’s looking for a new job.” But my manager? He noticed something was off.

He didn’t pry. He just said, “I’m here if you need anything.” And when I finally told him what I was going through—he didn’t judge. He listened. That didn’t change the company’s expectations, of course. I still had to hit quota. But it made me feel seen, and that made a difference.

2. Family

Then there’s my family. I had a two-hour phone call with my brother—well, I talked for nearly two hours, he probably got five minutes in. Which clearly earned him the “GREAT LISTENER” badge!!! But in those five minutes, he dropped something that hit hard. My mom had been wondering why I only called on the way to dinner. Calls that always ended abruptly when I reached the restaurant.

I hadn’t realized how that made her feel.

Like I was squeezing her into a schedule, not prioritizing our time.

That moment humbled me. This journey isn’t just affecting me—it’s affecting the people who love me. And that’s something I have to own.

Bobbie

Now for the part that hit me the hardest: Bobbie.

Bobbie has loved me through everything. And I’ll be honest—I don’t always understand how she does it. She sends me motivational videos, encourages walks, shares wellness tips, and somehow still believes in me when I can’t believe in myself.

She reminds me daily that there’s hope.

She educates me on ways to get through & reduce my anxiety & depression:

• That food is the most abused anxiety drug
• That sunlight is medicine
• That 7 minutes of laughter can change your entire mood
• That 8 hours of sleep isn’t optional
• That movement matters
• That I can still LIVE, not just survive

And she challenges me, lovingly, to put in the work. To show up for myself. Because she knows I can do it, even when I don’t.

----

The Goal

So here’s where I am today:
 I’m not “fixed.” This isn’t the end of the movie where everything gets tied up in a neat little bow.

But I’m better than I was four weeks ago.

This episode is more than a story—it’s a powerful reminder that depression doesn’t always look like what we expect. Through music, long drives, theater, and faith, Adam’s father found ways to navigate his darkest moments. And in doing so, he kept a promise to his children that shaped Adam’s own journey with depression.

Key Discussion Points:

• How childhood health struggles and school experiences planted early emotional wounds
• Facing antisemitism in education and community life
• The emotional toll of teaching and the transition into retirement
• Finding solace in music, fishing, acting, and service
• How depression affects relationships—and how counseling can help
• Parenting through depression and keeping promises that heal across generations

Key Takeaways:

• Depression can build over decades and resurface in surprising ways
• Coping mechanisms—like music, nature, or storytelling—can offer powerful relief
• Talking about pain doesn’t just bring healing—it passes on strength
• A parent’s quiet consistency may become a child’s lifelong anchor
• Retelling our stories can shift shame into legacy

Join the Conversation:

Have you had a conversation like this with a loved one? I’d love to hear your reflections. Email me at: dancingwithdepression@yahoo.com

Until next time, remember: when it comes to depression, Take the Lead.

Dancing With Depression is part of QuietLoud Studios.
A podcast network where reflection and voice come together.
Learn more: https://quietloudstudios.com/

Need assistance with your podcast? Connect with KazCM. They make content creation enjoyable and accessible.
Learn more: https://kazcm.com/

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More about this episode "The Double-Edged Sword of Social Media":

Do you think you spend too much time on Social Media? I don’t think I do…I KNOW I DO! Of course I have good reasons to be on platforms like Facebook, Instagram & TikTok…my wife views my “reasons” more like excuses.  I originally used Facebook to stay connected with my friends & family back after I moved to NC from CT.  I was able to watch the journey of a friend go from taking care of several teenagers to taking care of herself and graduate college – she was in her 40’s when she graduated with honors, I watched another friend live her dream & become a mother to 2 boys, not to mention all of the births, birthdays,Weddings, Anniversaries & other life changing events that took place while I was 800 miles away.  As far as Instagram & TikTok well…I’ve got nothing – it became more of a time sucker.  

I find the videos posted on Instagram & TikTok to be very entertaining, but 3 hours later the ONLY thing I can think about is the garbage still needs to be taken out, the dishes aren’t going to wash themselves & if I don’t do a load of laundry people are going to see me in the same clothes for the 3rd day in a row!!!  

Have you ever ask why we spend so much time on Social Media? Recently, I did just that!  I wanted to see when I went on, for how long, & what was I looking at.  I realized I went on to distract myself from “life”…it was an escape from having to be a responsible adult.  I was on different social media platforms for hours on end & the content I was consuming wasn’t specific – it ranged from watching people get their ear wax removed, to watching cattle get their hooves cleaned & cut, to barbers cutting hair, to dance competition videos, to sports highlights, and on and on and on.  The content was NEVER ENDING and it had WHATEVER YOU WERE LOOKING FOR AT THAT MOMENT!!!  Before TikTok I wasn’t interested in ear wax removal…but I am FACINATED BY IT NOW!!!  

The videos I mentioned are light hearted, but there is a never ending amount of videos that contains footage of things, in my opinion, the general public shouldn’t have access to. For example, a video showing a man being suffocated to death when an officer had his knee on the neck of the victim for 8 min & 46 seconds…of which 2 minutes & 53 seconds of that time the victim was non-responsive.  I’m not looking to start a debate about what happened leading up to that incident – my point is focused on the fact that anyone with cable, internet access or a smartphone could see the footage of this man’s eventual death.  What effect does this have on our society? How does a child, a teenager, a mother, a brother, a father, process this info – I’ve shared my experiences with death and the effect I believe they have on me 30+ years later.  The combination of curiosity & accessibility appears to be a dangerous combination.  Just the other day I was eating lunch and decided to distract myself by watching some videos online – when I read a caption that lead me to believe I really don’t want to watch this video…but I didn’t have the discipline not to hit play.  The caption reads “Laughing Teens Intentionally Drive Car Into Cyclist, KILLING HIM” – (PAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAUSE) After watching the video there were a few things that went through my mind: How? Why? & WHAT IS WRONG WITH ME?

The how was directed at how was this so easily accessible 

The why was about the thought process of these teenagers

Finally, the what is wrong with me was specific to the fact I just witnessed a man being murdered and it was as if I had watched this happen a dozen times before.  I was sympathetic and felt terrible thinking about this man, his family, etc.  But why wasn’t I crying, sick to my stomach, SOMETHING MORE!  Am I numb to this behavior? I don’t know with 100% certainty, but I do know it follows a similar pattern in my life as I track down the root of my depression. There is no question that ones’ personal experience will have a greater effect on that individual in comparison to learning or witnessing what they experienced, but for me hearing about someones traumatic experience or watching a video of it has had an effect on my mental health.  It’s like watching a scary movie – lets say specifically about ghosts…I might not have had a personal encounter with a ghost, heck I might not even “believe” ghosts exist, but you better believe if I find myself in a similar setting where the fog is rising from the ground late at night and the only sound I hear is that of an owl…I am confident my mind will recall the movie I watched & how it made me feel.  So is it far fetched that watching a video of a man taking his last breath or a bicyclist being mowed down by a car could have an impact on our mental health? 

I can't believe I just saw that happen... The feeling of shock and disbelief lingered in my mind long after I had closed the social media app. It was a video, one of those disturbing ones that seem to surface on your feed when you least expect it. It wasn't a scene from a horror movie or some fictional gore, but a stark, real-life incident that left me questioning not only my online habits but also the impact of such content on our mental health.

"Do you think you spend too much time on Social Media?" my wife had asked me once, and though I initially brushed it off, I couldn't help but wonder if she had a point. It's true; social media platforms like Facebook, Instagram, and TikTok have their merits. They connect us with friends and family, allowing us to witness the milestones and joys of their lives, even when we're miles apart. But lately, it seemed like I was drowning in an endless sea of content, scrolling past countless videos that ranged from amusing to outright bizarre.

I decided to investigate my own habits. I tracked when I went online, how long I stayed, and what I was looking at. The results were eye-opening. Social media had become an escape, a distraction from the responsibilities of adult life. Hours melted away as I watched everything from oddly satisfying earwax removals to the mesmerizing artistry of barbers cutting hair. It was a never-ending stream of content, tailored to whatever fleeting interest I had at the moment.

However, there was a darker side to this endless content stream. Among the light-hearted and entertaining videos, there lurked videos that exposed the harsh realities of the world. I stumbled upon a video showing a man being suffocated to death, pinned down by an officer's knee for agonizing minutes. The sheer accessibility of such traumatic content was disturbing. Anyone with an internet c...

Dancing With Depression is part of QuietLoud Studios.
A podcast network where reflection and voice come together.
Learn more: https://quietloudstudios.com/

Need assistance with your podcast? Connect with KazCM. They make content creation enjoyable and accessible.
Learn more: https://kazcm.com/

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More about this episode: "The Impact of Songs & “The One” That Spoke for Me"

We all have “our jams”, you know the songs that you can’t not dance to or stop yourself from crying – one can connect with a song for a variety of reasons: 

Relating to a song is a deeply personal and emotional experience that can vary from person to person. It often involves a strong connection between the lyrics, melody, and the listener's own thoughts, feelings, and experiences. Here are some ways in which someone can relate to a song:

1.     Lyrics: Many people relate to songs through the lyrics. When the words of a song resonate with someone's own experiences or emotions, it can create a powerful connection. Whether it's a breakup, a celebration, or a reflection on life, lyrics can capture the essence of a particular moment or feeling.

2.     Emotional resonance: Music has the unique ability to tap into our emotions and stir up deep-seated feelings. A song that mirrors your current emotional state or helps you express what you're feeling can be incredibly relatable. It's like the song is giving voice to your emotions.

3.     Personal experiences: Sometimes, a song can evoke memories and transport you back to a particular time and place in your life. When a song is linked to a specific memory or period, it can create a strong sense of connection.

4.     Themes and stories: Songs often tell stories or convey themes that are universally relatable. Whether it's a song about love, friendship, loss, or resilience, these themes can connect with a wide range of listeners who have experienced similar situations.

5.     Cultural and societal context: A song can also reflect the cultural or societal context in which it was created. It may address social issues, capture the spirit of a generation, or comment on current events. Listeners who identify with these contexts may find the song relatable in a broader sense.

6.     Musical elements: It's not always about the lyrics or the theme of a song. The music itself, including the melody, rhythm, and instrumentation, can evoke emotions and resonate with listeners. A simple melody can be just as relatable as profound lyrics.

7.     Identity and self-expression: Some songs can become anthems for individuals or communities, helping people express their identities or beliefs. These songs serve as a form of self-expression and create a sense of belonging.

8.     Interpretation and perspective: The same song can be interpreted in different ways by different people, depending on their unique perspectives and experiences. This allows for a diverse range of listeners to relate to a song in their own distinct manner.

9.     Personal growth and change: Songs that reflect personal growth, transformation, or overcoming challenges can be particularly relatable during times of change or self-discovery. They may serve as sources of inspiration and motivation.

10.  Connection with the artist: Sometimes, people relate to a song because they have a deep admiration for the artist. Their connection to the artist's life story, struggles, or creative journey can make the song more relatable.

In the end, relating to a song is a subjective and highly personal experience. It's about finding a piece of music that resonates with your emotions, experiences, and the unique story of your life. Music has the power to connect us with ourselves and others, providing solace, joy, and a sense of belonging in the process.

What song or song(s) do you connect with? 

How does it make you feel? 

Where does it take you? 

Who do you think of?

There are hundreds of songs that I connect with, but 3 songs that stand out – although  the genre, the message & the time in my life I was introduced to vary…they are all equally impactful! 

The first song that hits me is C.R.E.A.M by Wu-Tang Clan…I’ll let that sit for a second, not because I’m a 47 year old white guy from Connecticut…no wait that is EXACTLY why I will let you catch up.  If you have ever been to a Wu-Tang concert you wouldn’t really be surprised hearing a 47 year old white guy likes them – I’ve had the pleasure of seeing them twice – the 1st time they played with Rage Against the Machine and the 2nd time was 25 years later as they celebrated the release of 36 Chambers album.  The ONLY difference I saw – we all aged – some of us only 25 years, while others a little more!  Just like it was 25 years earlier, the crowd was a melting pot of people from all walks of life.  We all came together to appreciate great music! 

Connecting with a song, for me, can be in a few different ways.  The music, a hook or the lyrics as a whole can speak to me. I connect via the music for a lot of hip-hop songs, but when it comes to C.R.E.A.M it’s the message the hook delivers and I think that is important to understand, because if someone hears me singing “It’s been 22 long hard years of still strugglin’” --- “We got stickup kids, corrupt cops, and crack rocks  And stray shots, all on the block that stays hot” or “handcuffed in back of a bus, 40 of us” no one would be able to understand how I am “relating” to the lyrics.  However, when the hook comes in “Cash Rules Everything around me – CREAM get the money Dollar, Dollar bill, y’all”  it speaks directly to me.  If I wanted the new Air Jordan’s I needed money, if I wanted a car – I needed money, if I wanted to buy a house instead of renting – I needed more money --- then I started my sales career and Cash LITERALLY RULED EVERYTHING AROUND ME…there aren’t many things that can’t be taken care of with a little more cash. I don’t want to turn this into a debate, but I’ve heard the argument that money can’t buy you love & I agree with you on that, buuuuuuuuuuut it has bought things that resemble “love” – all kidding aside the other one I hear is – It can’t buy you time/health…I agree it can’t buy you perfect health or an unlimited amount of time, but money can buy better health care which leads to living longer…just ask Magic Johnson!!!  

The next song that I connect with on a deep level is Shania Twain’s “From This Moment On” – this is Bobbie & I’s wedding song! I get chills just thinking about it.  Our love story doesn’t start until our late 30’s as I met Bobbie when she was 37 & I was 39. We met on JDATE (a Jewish Dating Website) – and this love story happens QUICK.  I liked her...

Call to Action: If you or someone you know is struggling with the loss of a friend, remember you’re not alone. Reach out for support, whether it’s through a trusted friend, family member, or professional counselor. Healing takes time, but sharing your story can be a powerful step towards finding peace.

Do you have a story to share, a question, or a topic suggestion for a future episode? Email me at DancingWithDepression@yahoo.com.

Dancing With Depression is part of QuietLoud Studios.
A podcast network where reflection and voice come together.
Learn more: https://quietloudstudios.com/

Need assistance with your podcast? Connect with KazCM. They make content creation enjoyable and accessible.
Learn more: https://kazcm.com/

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More about this episode "Grief and Growth: Losing Friends Before 23 and Its Impact on Depression":

I'm your host, Adam Turner, and today we're going to delve into a topic that hits close to home for many of us – the profound impact of losing friends at an early age and how it can cast a long shadow on the path of our lives.

You see, life is a tapestry woven with threads of laughter, shared memories, and the bonds we build with the people around us. But sometimes, those threads are cut way too short, leaving us grappling with a sense of emptiness that lingers for years. That's exactly what happened to me. As I stand here at 47 years old, I can't help but look back and recognize the weight that these losses have had on my journey with depression.

As sons of a Lay Rabbi, my brother & I were often called upon to funeral services that my dad would conduct. I wouldn’t be surprised if by the age of 17 my brother had been to a few dozen funerals, some for family while others were for people we didn’t know well. So I was very familiar with Jewish Funerals and the traditions that come along with it. What I WASN’T prepared for is when a High School classmate was killed in an auto-accident during our Senior Year. He was the Senior Class President, the multi-sport athlete and honestly just an all around nice guy! He lived just a block away so we would spend a lot of time together.  We would play tennis baseball in his backyard, he taught me how to play table tennis (not good enough to beat him, but he taught me enough to play), a favorite was sledding down what then appeared to be a MONSTER hill…and when it was raining we would sit in front of the television and play MIKE TYSON’S KNOCKOUT on the Nintendo Entertainment System!!! It was October 30th and he was driving home after attending the schools Halloween Dance…he was dressed as Kenny Rogers “The Gambler” and he NAILED IT!!! I believe his date was dressed as Dolly Parton (but I wasn’t at the dance & my memory isn’t what it use to be).  When I was told what happened, time just stood still…I didn’t know how to feel as this was someone that I spent time with, went to 12 years of school with & competed with on his team & against him…. My father consoled me…best he could – The next thing I remember was calling hours at one of the local funeral homes.  We lived a block away and decided to walk. As we turned the corner towards the Funeral Home I remember thinking to myself…holy crap!  There was a line down the street for a couple of blocks…all I could hear was crying as we approached to pay our respects.  We finally made it into the doors of the Funeral Home, we saw his younger sister, older brother mother & father…and then I froze. I looked towards the casket as I had many times before at the funerals I attended, but NEVER in my life had I been to an open casket. My friend lying there & I see him! As we made our ways through the line I noticed his dad touching my friends shoulder before shaking everyones hand and thanking them for coming.  Just as I heard on the way in the tears remained on our way out, but it was shortly after leaving the screams of terror from my brother that frightened me most…he also was traumatized after seeing the body of our once VIBRANT friend with nothing but a bright future ahead of him. I still think about him…and when I do I smile and sing “you’ve got to know when to hold em’, know when to fold em’, know when to walk away, know when to run, you never count your money when your sittin at the table, there’ll be time enough for countin’ when the dealin’s done! 

Tim – was one of my three sophomore year roommates. Tim was quietly hilarious. In order to help pay for school, he would substitute teach at the local high school. Like me, he wasn’t a morning person, so when the call to substitute came in at 5:30 a.m. he had to evaluate how he felt from the night before and surprisingly he would accept…almost every time they called him.  However, there was this one particular morning that he received a call to come in and I heard him say he wasn’t going to be able to cover that day.  My curiosity got the best of me and so I asked him “Tim, why didn’t you accept!” He said: “Adam, I don’t want to be an adult today…I want to be a college student!!!”  It was so Tim to just tell it how it was, no BS…

Although I didn’t know Tim for a long time, about a year and a half, I knew him long enough to build a bond a very strong bond…that tends to happen when you live together.  So to receive the news that Tim & his girlfriend was in a car accident, the 1st thing that came to mind was Ben…I ask the police officer if they were going to be ok & the response sent me into an instant frenzy.  The police officer said that Tim was killed in the accident & his girlfriend was “fighting for her life”…in that moment there are so many questions – How did this happen? Where did it happen? Etc.  The passing of Tim was difficult for all that knew him.  In the coming weeks, we would have a special tribute on campass where friends could share their thoughts and say our final goodbye to our friend.  The University was incredibly supportive, checking in on the three of us as we try to make sense of what was going on around us.  The University prepared us meals (breakfast, lunch & dinner) for the next couple of weeks, provided resources for counseling, & reached out to our professors regarding the accident. Meanwhile, Tim’s HS friend and roommate was at the hospital to support Tim’s girlfriend…who was fighting for her life.  She had multiple painful surgeries & he wanted to be there when she woke up from them…the news wasn’t going to be easy to share, but he knew it would be even harder hear.  How do you tell someone that the person you love is no longer with us?

Through the toughest of times, there still can be a silver lining.  His girlfriend survived, she is still physically & mentally scared from that tragic night…yet somehow was able to make lemonade from those sour lemons.  Tim’s HS friend & roommate ended up marrying and have 2 beautiful twin girls – MIRACLE of MIRACLES!  Don’t get this twisted like a Jerry Springer episode…They didn’t care for each other at first – the typical buddy wanting to hang out with his “boy” but Girlfriend always ruined that.  However, when you look at most successful relationships/marriages they are often times woven together tightly with sim...

Got a story to share, a question, or a topic suggestion for a future episode? Reach out to me at DancingWithDepression@yahoo.com.

Dancing With Depression is part of QuietLoud Studios.
A podcast network where reflection and voice come together.
Learn more: https://quietloudstudios.com/

Need assistance with your podcast? Connect with KazCM. They make content creation enjoyable and accessible.
Learn more: https://kazcm.com/

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More about this episode "Childhood Under Siege: A 7-Year-Old's Memory of a Bomb Threat":

Do you ever question where your depression comes from?

I often wonder if it was my overall upbringing or if the situation could be the reason for years of depression. Seeing as how I’m NOT a doctor…I don’t know the answer to that question, but it has led me to think back on my childhood to see if I could identify a specific incident or a pattern of incidents that might have contributed to my current mental health.

This one takes us back to the 80s when I was just a young boy.  My brother, father & I were attending the High Holiday Services at my grandfather's Temple in West Hartford, CT. I won’t pretend to “love” spending 6 hours in prayer, but I loved being with my Poppa, Dad & brother.  The morning was like many others: my brother & I fighting to wake up…we weren’t, & 40 years later, we still aren’t morning people! Yet we battled through our sleep deprivation and managed to get ourselves dressed. We arrived at the temple & proceeded to the front pew, where we sat with my Poppa. 

The service started as well as “The Countdown”…over the next 6 hours the question “How much longer before we can leave?” would be asked at least a ½ dozen times…c’mon we were 7 & 9 years old!  For the most part things were normal, then one sentence later EVERYTHING changed.  My dad leaned over to instruct my brother & I what to do should the door located directly in front of us open.  I remember thinking to myself “that door leads outside?” – I always thought it was just a broom closet -  My dad, in a calm but assertive tone, instructed us what we were to do should someone open that door…you are to both get on the ground and pretend to be dead.  At the time I didn’t think anything of it, and went on with what I usually did – sit there and wonder when we were going to be done so we could go play with our cousins!  

The 6 hours had come & gone and we were headed back to my Nona & Poppa’s house where our cousins would join us…there would be basketball, swimming, food & most definitely laughter. However, on the ride home I did have a 7 years old curiosity moment & asked “Dad why did you tell us to lay on the ground & act dead should someone walk through the door at the front of the synogage?”  It was as if he was waiting for the question all morning & had prepared what he was going to say. Yet it was so simple, “There was a bomb threat at the temple!” – That was it & for a 7 year old…that was all I needed at that time.  

As time went on I needed more of an understanding as to why someone would want to blow up a building with people in it…but I also had questions for my Dad:

When did you know about the bomb threat? 

If you knew about the threat before we went, why would you take your children?

Did MOM KNOW ABOUT THE POTENTIAL THREAT?

Were you scared?

Why would a bomb threat lead you to think there could be an active shooter?

As I was reflecting back to that day, I noticed a pattern:

-        in the 6th grade kids didn’t want to be my friend because they were afraid they would be killed in the bomb attack

-        years later as we pulled up to the synagogue, we saw the building vandalized with swastikas. 

The vandals were identified, and my father was contacted by the police to determine if he was going to charge the 2 teenagers with a hate crime.  When my father learned how the boys were identified & their age, he requested to meet with the boys 1st then make a decision if a hate crime charge should be filed. One of the boys had been having nightmares about the incident, & his mother “turned him in”!  My father asked to meet the boys, at their house with their parents in attendance. My father asked the boys a few questions like “do you know what the swastika represents & why it is hurtful?” The boys looked confused and one finally mustered up the courage to speak – He said “Honestly I don’t know what it means…”  My father, believing him, turned to me & asked me how I “FELT” when we pulled up to the synagogue and saw the swastikas on the building! I shared that I was terrified. My father asked me why I was terrified - so I continued, “Because a few years ago we went to temple during the High Holidays and there was a bomb threat…all I could think about was if this was another situation where I could die! The boys & I started to ball our eyes out… 

That was enough for my father to know they just made a bad decision…my father – the educator – saw this as an opportunity to teach. He asked that the boys remove the spray painted swastikas from the temple and write an essay to be shared with the boys classmates on why this was wrong.  So was the lesson learned…in many cases we don’t know, but in this one I think we can chalk it up as a LESSON LEARNED.  How? Well the temple was holding a fundraiser (which my father & I can’t remember what specifically it was for) and the 1st donation came in the form of a check from the Mother & Son!

I don’t believe that ONE isolated bomb threat is the reason that 40 years later I don’t sit with my back to a door, however I do believe a series of events contributed to my anxiety. As I grew older, my anxiety began to manifest in various ways. Crowded places became overwhelming; trust in the world around me waned. It wasn’t until therapy that I started tracing back these emotions to that fateful day at the synagogue.

It has been a journey of self-discovery, a dance with my own demons. The support of loved ones was crucial, and learning to validate my own emotions was a pivotal step. With guidance of therapy, I gradually exposed myself to triggers, rewiring my thought patterns and reclaiming my sense of control.

To those dancing alongside their own demons, I would say: You’re NOT alone. Seek support, be it through therapy or the embrace of understanding friends and family. Know that healing takes time, and it’s okay to stumble along the way. Embrace each step, each misstep, as part of your unique dance.

I hope today’s episode has inspired you to step into your own power and embrace the driver’s seat of your life’s journey.  Remember, life doesn’t just happen to us – we can shape our path, make bold decisions, and navigate the twists and turns. So, as you go about your day, don’t forget to seize those opportunities, make those choices, and always remember to TAKE THE LEAD.

I am your host, Adam Turner.

In this episode, I dive into the origins of the podcast name and what it symbolizes for me. I reflect on how my daily "dance" with depression once dominated my life, leaving me mentally exhausted by dinnertime.

I'll share candidly about my initial misconceptions regarding the causes of depression and how I came to realize that I was only scratching the surface of this complex issue.

Moreover, I discuss my heartfelt intention behind starting this podcast: to create a safe and supportive space where people can feel genuinely heard and understood.

Lastly, I give special thanks and shout-outs to the individuals who inspired and guided me on this journey of podcast creation.

Join me as we embark on this journey together, exploring the depths of depression and finding strength in sharing our stories.

Stay tuned for more episodes of 'Dancing with Depression.'

Dancing With Depression is part of QuietLoud Studios.
A podcast network where reflection and voice come together.
Learn more: https://quietloudstudios.com/

Need assistance with your podcast? Connect with KazCM. They make content creation enjoyable and accessible.
Learn more: https://kazcm.com/

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More about this episode "Behind the Name: ‘Dancing with Depression’":

In today’s episode I will shed some light on how this Podcast came to be, what Dancing With Depression means to me & How I was “introduced” to my Depression!

The podcast was a combination of guilt, curiosity & technology. The guilt was my inability to stay connected with my parents. I noticed that I would go days – then weeks without talking to my parents. I often thought about calling them and even set alarms to remind myself, but the phone felt like a ton of bricks, and I would convince myself that I would call them tomorrow…then tomorrow came, same thing & on & on & on. I can recall conversations with a couple of close friends that shared they talk to their parents EVERYDAY, so I questioned myself as to why I didn’t call mine.

I looked to my job, a marketing consultant, as to the reason why the phone felt so heavy, but quickly realized that was just an excuse. Sure, my day consists of making 50-70 phone calls, running 3-4 Zoom Meeting, not to mention prep work, follow up & paperwork…but everyone is doing that much work if not more in the course of their day…so I knew I had to look deeper.
I determined that my depression was like a shadow – it was always by my side! So, I’m constantly addressing it to get through my day. I must remind myself before each phone call why I am doing this – to pay bills, I have to make things appear to be ok, when internally all I wanted to do was push MUTE, so I don’t have to hear all of the thoughts swirling around in my brain. I’ve known for years that sales wasn’t my calling – for starters my personality would be categorized as introverted but depending on the environment I can also be an extrovert – specifically my work environment…I didn’t pick sales; my Credit Card Balances did!!! (LOL) 
I was Dancing with Depression all day and was too tired to do anything else.  We all know Dancing for 8-10 hours a day would make our legs feel like Jell-O…so does the mental aspect of trying to direct my depression where I needed it to go throughout the day. When my depression wanted to go left; I had to redirect that energy to the right…For instance - If I had a meeting, I had to be ON – that meant smiling (even when I was down), I had to be friendly (even when I wanted to be alone, I had to educate (even when well you get the point).  At the end of the day, it all added up to being MENTALLY EXHAUSTED, which was negatively affecting all other aspects of my life!  
So, I became curious – what was fostering my depression. Growing up, I believed that depression was often linked to a traumatic childhood…like physical, sexual, or emotional abuse, neglect, parents with mental illness or addiction, severe childhood illnesses, domestic violence, bullying, or racism. These experiences can undoubtedly increase the likelihood of depression, but at the time I didn’t recall experiencing any of these traumas….So, I was left puzzled about the root cause of MY depression.

Finally, I was looking for a way to connect – safely with others that were experiencing what I was experiencing. When I was first diagnosed with depression, I remember feeling lonely, as if I had to hide something from everyone. Only to later find out 5 of my close co-workers were taking Anxiety or Depression Medication – knowing I wasn’t “the only one” provided me the comfort I was seeking.  Which got me thinking – Could others benefit from knowing they aren’t alone?
I felt strongly the answer to that was YES, but I knew it had to be in a safe space. After giving it a little thought, I recalled a conversation about Podcasts I had a few years ago, with my cousin, Elizabeth. At the time she was working at ESPN and it felt like every other word out of her mouth was Podcast. Which made me feel old because I had only listened to a couple of episodes of random podcasts.  I did, however, remember feeling secure and not worrying about what someone thought regarding the content I was listening to. It was the very platform I needed to share Dancing With Depression. 

So I had the Topic: Depression – The Reason: Connect & Share - & The Platform: Podcast…but there was still one thing holding me back - I had NO CLUE WHAT TO DO!  So, the idea sat on the shelf for months, collecting dust. With my inability to motivate myself after 6 p.m., I was convinced it would stay there for eternity. But then, I met Nadia through a sales lead at my company. After a brief conversation, we both realized that she didn't need the services we provided. But while reviewing her website, I noticed a section about podcasts. We spent a good hour discussing her services, and she had the layout and experience to guide me.  She asked me about my ideas, what I wanted to accomplish and, well, HERE WE ARE! It's still hard to believe, but I am incredibly thankful for the opportunity to share this journey with you. And I hope you'll share your experiences with me.